Talk:Social class in the United Kingdom

The Jilly Coooper book "Class" is a comedy book and should not be referenced as a source of fact. Also, David Cameron is upper class, his wife is the daughter of a baronet.

I'm really surprised that this is as far as Wikipedia goes with social class in Britain. Am I looking in the wrong place? I am an American living in Britain, and I notice there are multiple pages dedicated to US class differences. But class divisions in the US are, in my opinion, negligible compared to those which exist so clearly in Britain. Is the absence of an article due to the fact that people would rather focus on US class differences or just because there is a smaller pool of people who can competently write on British social class?

I don't have time to write the article; otherwise I would. If anyone wants to take up the task, I recommend Watching the English by Kate Fox as a reference.

I find the article disappointing. The use of "et cetera" reads like an admission that the writer is unsure of his ground. The table is not of any one period, making it of little value - it mentions both villeins and baronets, though baronets only existed from 1611, by which time villeins no longer existed. It completely omits the large and important class of tenant farmers. The idea that "by the 17th century, the knight was a large land owner, and likely a lawyer, priest, or official of some sort" is ludicrous - if it made it clear whether it was referring to a man who rode a horse into battle or to someone holding the rank of knight, it might make sense, but the writer appears to have confused the two. Maproom (talk) 00:07, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Coming across this article there's an awful lot of subtle snobbery throughout this article that breaks Wikipedia's NPOV. I'll create a proper account later and start editing later. As an opening observation, is it really fair to say that David Cameron is Upper Middle Class or to have examples of people that are comedy characters for the lower classes in this article where more serious figures are given as the examples for the higher classes? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.220.46.184 (talk) 07:18, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm not necessarily against it, but I have to say I love the person who added all the Jilly Cooper bits. Hilarious! -Tpacw (talk) 14:34, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

This article is dreadful on many counts, it needs serious work. Particualrly noticeable is he very clear coorelation between class and lenght of article -- the upperclassses get lengthy essays, the workign classes get a couple of sentences. 1Z (talk) 10:00, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Britain or UK?

The article uses "Britain" and "UK" interchangeably - are the Northern Irish counted or not? EamonnPKeane (talk) 22:19, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

The Government of the UK decided that the terms Britain and British can be used to describe the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, whereas the term Great Britain can only be used in the geographical sense. As a result Britain and the UK are used correctly within the article 86.134.44.173 (talk) 16:14, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Do you (or anyone) have a citation for this? Jaruzel (talk) 12:21, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

"The Chavs"

Is "chav" really the most appropriate word for this context? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.111.8.97 (talk) 21:43, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Further to this, is the "underclass" really more likely to partake in controlled substances, the drug use is prevalent at University Campuses, and cocaine remains the designer drug of choice for journos and bankers. Lostsocks (talk) 18:09, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Slavery

I'm wondering if, during all these hundreds of years, did anyone ever call this social structure system slavery? Does anyone know?Stars4change (talk) 05:38, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

Headings

The formating for the Class headings aren't consisten. (See Upper Class & Upper Middle Class bigger & underlined, others not.) I'm new and not really done any page formatting yet, so won't do it myself yet. If no one else wants to, I'll come back and do it in a bit. Dannman (talk) 16:05, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

- I've done this 83.244.203.162 (talk) 09:41, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Is David Cameron upper middle class

Given that David Cameron is a fifth cousin of the queen and attended eton I would say he is of the upper class. Redface1 (talk) 20:45, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Rugby at Eton

The article states that "paradoxically neither Eton nor Winchester College play Rugby" This fact is incorrect as a main sport at Eton during the first half is Rugby. I have changed the Eton inaccuracy, but am unsure about Winchester College, can anyone verify this claim? 86.134.44.173 (talk) 16:16, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

"Underclass"

This section is utterly *atrocious* in quality, and drags the whole article down. None of the statements are cited, and the use of the term "chav", as mentioned above, is rather out-of-place. The mention of the movie "Idiocracy" stands out as completely unnecessary. I'll try and tidy it up a bit, but someone more in-the-know on this subject than myself needs to come add in some properly sourced statements, and probably re-write the entire section. 86.28.149.134 (talk) 15:03, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

- Had a try at revising, but in the end just deleted all the unsourced statements. Removed the portrayals in popular culture as well - every one of them was a negative portrayal. Perhaps add one of them back in alongside a sympathetic, or at least neutral portrayal later? 86.28.149.134 (talk) 15:03, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

David Cameron

I've removed David Cameron as "a popular example of" the Upper Middle class. It's a matter of no small controversy- having caused many outraged headlines when he proclaimed it himself. Without citation, it's just asking for trouble. In my opinion, he fits in far better with Upper class by this article's own definitions: his grandfather was Sir William Mount, 2nd Baronet, his father in law is Sir Reginald Adrian Berkeley Sheffield, 8th Baronet, his mother in law is the Viscountess Astor, he was educated first at Eton College, then at Oxford University, he's the most powerful man in the country job-wise, is a multi-millionaire, and owns more personal housing and land than he can actually recount on demand. If we must have him in the Upper Middle class section, we're going to need some solid citation. 62.255.138.180 (talk) 10:30, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Note that Cameron is also a lineal descendant of King William IV. Strictly speaking, he is a member of the provincial gentry. Most of the writing in this article is historically illiterate (and seems to be based on a popular book written by a woman called Kate Fox). I have managed to improve it somewhat.Avaya1 (talk) 03:54, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Entire upper class article

This is a farce! Have the authors of this article ever met or seen the English nobility?

The worst piece of feeble-minded generalization I have ever come across. This borders on vandalism from the start - the final bit with Kate Fox references is utterly foolish and represents the narrow view of an absolute nobody.

Delete, delete, delete! Croquet a defining trait of class? I have never heard anything so preposterous and ridiculous in my life!