Wikipedia:Possibly unfree files/2008 December 14
December 14
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted as I4 by Sherool (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Image source was Google Image search, which leads me to believe that it is likely not free-to-use.
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Image was deleted from Commons following Commons:Deletion requests/Image:FallRiver1.jpg. As stated there, there's no clear evidence that this is a USN image. Angus McLellan (Talk) 00:08, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
unused school logo, most likely (C) held by school & not uploader Skier Dude (talk) 02:50, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
watermark & description Madison Chua of Magma Heritage make it appear that uploader is not (c) holder Skier Dude (talk) 02:51, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
no source given for base images, "permission" is 'a sample of the museum print' which indicates base image is (c) Skier Dude (talk) 03:00, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
appears to be professional headshot, orphaned Skier Dude (talk) 03:02, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
orphaned image, appears to be screenshot and not (c) of uploader Skier Dude (talk) 03:03, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
What part of I took the photo myself do you not understand? I work at KUSI-TV. He came by to be interviewed. I took his photo with my camera, not off of a TV screen. It is NOT a screen shot.
If you have removed it, return it.
All you have to do is ask..... http://americanindian.net/kusi.html
Phil Konstantin —Preceding unsigned comment added by Philkon (talk • contribs) 22:18, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Item was orphaned when I listed it here - I didn't remove it from any article. If uploader wants it in an article, it's his responsibility to put it therein. Second, the specific source of the image is required (and is not on the image page) and would prove the uploader's claim of (c) holding. Skier Dude (talk) 01:59, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
given nature of poster, (c) would most likely be held by club or sponsoring org Skier Dude (talk) 03:06, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
orphaned, no proof of unknown photographer's release via OTRS Skier Dude (talk) 03:11, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
orphaned website logo, most likely (c) held by site and not uploader Skier Dude (talk) 03:12, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
no source given, appears to be publicity headshot Skier Dude (talk) 03:13, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
(c) notice in lower left hand corner - no indication uploader is (c) holder Skier Dude (talk) 03:22, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
derivative of (c) fox logo (used for the Simpsons Movie promos) Skier Dude (talk) 03:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
orphaned corporate logo Skier Dude (talk) 03:27, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
summary = "DVD cover art for Slide America", therefore Slide America would most likely be the (c) holder and not the uploader Skier Dude (talk) 03:30, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Image is a recreation of a copyrighted logo. –Dream out loud (talk) 03:45, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
orphaned, given description "1969 'Naqsh e faryadi' painted by Shakir Ali. Image on display of stamps in Pakistan" (c) is most likely not the uploader Skier Dude (talk) 04:42, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
orphaned, claim to (c) is doubtful; summary is contradictory regarding (c) holder Skier Dude (talk) 04:44, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
A Google search for "suffolkcam" came up with http://www.suffolkcam.co.uk/ If that is the source, the disclaimer for using the images from the site is: "You are welcome to copy and use any of these photographs on this website for non commercial purposes (for commercial use please contact me) but please credit Ian Davey as the photographer, and if used on a website please add a link to the page." Note the non commercial purposes part. Rockfang (talk) 05:35, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- I have uploaded another pic of the same bridge Image:Allerford bridge.jpg which is CC from Geograph & replaced the image on 2 articles.— Rod talk 08:59, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
No information beyond "Private snapshot" from the uploader. I'm not sure whether to list at public domain (I'm considering for Commons) or to just ignore that and list as non-free promotional (it's got a good fair use rationale since he died in 1993). Ricky81682 (talk) 10:02, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The photo I provided was a copy of a photo that I took in the 1980s and therefore I decided to put it as public domain !!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Isisosiris (talk • contribs) 09:50, 19 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
While User:77.166.144.67 has been playing with licenses, a weapon made in 1948 is definitely not going to be PD-old like here. Ricky81682 (talk) 10:15, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted as I9 by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Image from [1], where it is sourced to sowetan.co.za/News/ Lupo 13:57, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Delete very likely a copyright violation, also see their upload log for more questionable copyvios. --Kanonkas : Talk 23:00, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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Batch of images for examination from WP:CP
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The result of the discussion was: Deleted.-FASTILY (TALK) 06:54, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
DumbBot has been busy. These images were all listed at Wikipedia:Copyright problems/2008 December 12. As images are not handled there, I'm bringing them here for attention from the wonderful folk here who handle image issues. :) I've looked at several. Some are tagged with {{copyvio}}, but at least one, File:32. Imperial stormtrooper costume.JPG, is marked {{derivative}}. I don't know if there are other issues being picked up as well. If text copyvios and RL allow me time, I'll see if I can address some of these myself. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 14:21, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:32. Imperial stormtrooper costume.JPG (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one was tagged as a derivative work in August. It's an interior shot at what seems to be a public event of some people in Star Wars costumes. I'm notifying the uploader. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 12:41, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- I've self-deleted it just to be on the safe side. Thanks for informing me. Seraphim♥ 00:55, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one was tagged as a derivative work in August. It's an interior shot at what seems to be a public event of some people in Star Wars costumes. I'm notifying the uploader. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 12:41, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:ComparisnofOV.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one is evidently here because it has strange licensing terms,including the requirement that the copyright holder be notified of use: http://www.astronautix.com/articles/conssite.htm. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 12:44, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- I don't think this particular image can "significantly increase readers' understanding of the topic", as per the non-free content criteria, because of its low resolution and lack of dimensions. Nathan Baum (talk) 01:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted. There was no fair use claim on the page in any case. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:ISROorbitalvehicle.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Rudolf Koivu .jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Janke, the user who tagged this, said "wrong PD template, cannot be 100 years, this photo was taken in the 1910s or early 1920s." --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:13, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Vautour FC.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one seems bizarre. It's claimed under OTRS provided by UbiSoft which claims that the company "allows the users to publish screenshots of all their games under a free license." But it's a logo from a soccer team that seems to have nothing to do with UbiSoft at all. The article on the team, contributed by the same person, was deleted thrice under G11. I don't see that UbiSoft is connected to this team at all. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:47, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Yanga1.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Evidently, this one is here because there's no evidence of the permission asserted by the uploader. The website from which it was taken, here, bears a copyright notice. I've tagged it "no permission" and notified the uploader. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:57, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:MsLynch.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one seems to be here as an image that looks less a press release. I found no source image. This and the subsequent five were uploaded by the same contributor. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:02, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted due to lack of source. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:NiamhPerry.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one seems to be here as an image that looks less a press release. I found no source image. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:03, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted due to lack of source info. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Keavyedele.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Source seems to be http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=277041093. Repairing tags and notifying contributor. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 22:23, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted due to lack of source info. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:SarahLark.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- I found no source image. This is by the same uploader as previous three, and I'm guessing that's why it's here. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:20, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted, although I would entertain a request to restore this one if more clarification on the source of the photo was forthcoming. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Tuckerdorothy.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This is by the same uploader as previous four, and I'm guessing that's why it's here. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:35, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted, as previous. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Tuckerpride.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This one, same uploader as past five, lists a photographer by name but is nevertheless released under "pd-self". --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:41, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Deleted. Stifle (talk) 12:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved
[edit]File:ShowofShows4.jpg(history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]- Tagged with {{non-free reduce}}, since what's of concern with this "fair use" image is evidently its size. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 13:33, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:GOLF-VIJAY.jpg (history · last edit) from [2]. Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:BacheletGov.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Cheryl X FACTOR.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Gtz-advantages-of-ecosan.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Tagged this one {{di-no permission}}. It's a derivative work of clearly copyrighted http://www2.gtz.de/dokumente/bib/06-1322.pdf. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 22:12, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Hi-res-savasocket-mobile.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:MRD00Gilda.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:MRD02Ruth.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:MRD1999Luz.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:MRDU03Amelia.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Miss-DR-universum-sone.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Monteverdi 450 SS.jpg (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This is a derivative work of http://www.supercars.net/carpics/3920/1970_Monteverdi_Hai450SS1.jpg. You can still see the green reflected on the rim. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 22:40, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- How in the world did your bot catch that? In any event, based on the uploader's other uploads, it's not surprising. --B (talk) 03:50, 16 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- It's not my bot. :) But credit for that catch goes to User:Roguegeek, who tagged it here. DumbBot picked it up for CP because it was tagged with an article rather than an image tag and because the extension was changed from image -> file. Go, DumbBot! --Moonriddengirl (talk) 20:02, 16 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- How in the world did your bot catch that? In any event, based on the uploader's other uploads, it's not surprising. --B (talk) 03:50, 16 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- This is a derivative work of http://www.supercars.net/carpics/3920/1970_Monteverdi_Hai450SS1.jpg. You can still see the green reflected on the rim. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 22:40, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Stef nochemv.png (history · last edit) (url not detected). Nomination completed by DumbBOT (talk) 00:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
No evidence uploader is copyright holder. Kelly hi! 17:36, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
No evidence uploader is copyright holder. Kelly hi! 17:37, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This image has been copied from the Internet. The site it is sourced from makes it clear that images are copyright. TimTay (talk) 20:11, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: Keep for now.-FASTILY (TALK) 06:53, 25 February 2012 (UTC) This image has been copied from the Internet. The site it is sourced from makes it clear that images are copyright. TimTay (talk) 20:17, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted as I4 by Orangemike (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This image has been copied from the Internet. The site it is sourced from makes it clear that images are copyright. TimTay (talk) 20:21, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Replaced with an almost identical and confirmed-free image Image:Kingston fire station.jpg on Wikimedia commons. So this image is now redundant.--TimTay (talk) 14:28, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This image has been copied from the Internet. The site it is sourced from makes it clear that images are copyright. TimTay (talk) 20:23, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Replaced with a confirmed-free image Image:Greenbank fire station.jpg on Wikimedia commons, so no reason at all to keep this questionable version. --TimTay (talk) 14:22, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Skier Dude (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This image has been copied from the Internet. The site it is sourced from makes it clear that images are copyright. TimTay (talk) 20:23, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- Replaced with confirmed-free version on Wikimedia commons - Image:Torquay fire station.jpg - so this version is now redundant.--TimTay (talk) 14:34, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by B (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) A file with this name on Commons is now visible. AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
License not free license — HoboJones (talk) 20:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
[reply]
- Uploader asserts GFDL based on this email from copyright owner. However, the email is not an effective release of the image into a free license, as required by wikipedia policy. In fact, the email explicitly re-asserts copyright ownership of the image.--HoboJones (talk) 20:30, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
"Please see the attached picture. We hope this helps. Thanks so much for your support.Copyright (C) Steele for Chairman PO Box 320114 Alexandria, VA 22320 Everyone is permitted to copy and distribute verbatim copies of this license document, but changing it is not allowed. Steele for Chairman"
Yea i emailed him back, and he released it to public domain, and the email is in the OTRS. -- Rockyobody (talk) 00:37, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- OTRS ticket has been recorded for this image. - Mark 02:59, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- PUI withdrawn by nom. PD license sent via email, recorded via OTRS.--HoboJones (talk) 20:09, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the debate was: Delete; deleted by Stifle (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 01:28, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Very likely a copyright violation, also see their upload log for more questionable copyvios. Kanonkas : Talk 23:00, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Do not remove my photo
[edit]Image:ShaunToubbyPhilKonstantin2007.jpg
orphaned image, appears to be screenshot and not (c) of uploader Skier Dude (talk) 03:03, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
What part of I took the photo myself do you not understand? I work at KUSI-TV. He came by to be interviewed. I took his photo with my camera, not off of a TV screen. It is NOT a screen shot.
If you have removed it, return it.
All you have to do is ask..... http://americanindian.net/kusi.html
Phil Konstantin —Preceding unsigned comment added by Philkon (talk • contribs) 22:19, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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