It's funny how in every adaptation of Helen she is down bad for Paris while in the Illiad she hyping up her husband to beat him

Team Green hates to hear it, but the Hightowers had absolutely no say in whether or not the Velaryon boys were legitimate and neither did Vaemond 🤷‍♀️

This whole paternity bullshit is something that was between House Velaryon and House Targaryen, and House Velaryon and House Targaryen ONLY---as they were the only houses that would be affected by the paternity dispute in any way.

House Hightower had no horse in that race and therefore no say in their legitimacy---they could believe whatever they wanted behind closed doors, but that wasn't the issue. The issue was that the Hightowers were knowingly spreading rumors amongst the other houses to try and deny the Velaryon boys' inheritance and then OPENLY QUESTIONED their legitimacy in PUBLIC COURT to do so.

The Velaryons and the Targaryens had already come to a conclusion on the matter: the Velaryon boys were, in fact, legitimate. The matter was over and done with. The Hightowers were sticking their noses into a situation that wasn't their business and that had already been settled---based solely on the fact that the boys "didn't LOOK Velaryon," no less.

The Hightowers trying to have any say in the succession of Driftmark would be like House Lannister trying to have a say in who would inherit Winterfell. It makes no fucking sense.

Not to mention that questioning legitimacy based solely on APPEARANCE is a very dangerous precedent to set, especially when it's an entirely DIFFERENT HOUSE that's allowed to set it on ANOTHER HOUSE'S SUCCESSION.

Say what you will about the books, but in them the Velaryon boys were---in all likelihood---Laenor's legitimate children. Rhaenys had dark hair, Aemma was never described in the books but we know she had Arryn blood and the Arryn's were known for having dark hair, and the only Strong- (aka the house that people accuse of being the Velaryon boys' "blood") -that was described in the books was fucking BLONDE!

In the show it's a different matter but, still, if every single person directly involved in the matter---Viserys, Laenor, Rhaenyra, Corlys, and Rhaenys---claims those boys as their own and say that THEY ARE LEGITIMATE, why the hell should another house get a say in whether or not that's true? Why would it matter?

Simple answer: it wouldn't!

Could you imagine if Cersei Lannister was allowed to question Robb Stark's legitimacy based solely on the fact that he didn't look like Ned Stark, his father? Despite the fact that everyone involved and the fucking KING said he was legitimate?

Because, under Team Green's logic, that would be a sound argument. Whether they look like their mother or someone else from either line doesn't matter, and it doesn't matter if both families---including the patriarchs/matriarchs and the fucking parents themselves---say the boys are legitimate either. All that matters is if they look like their father, and if they don't: bastard!

It's impractical and, above all else, fucking stupid!

House Hightower has no say in the matters of House Targaryen and House Velaryon.

Vaemond, unlike the Hightowers, was at least apart of the houses being affected by the succession and therefore had more of a say in it than Otto and Alicent...but that still didn't mean that he had much of one.

Vaemond was the son of a second son in the books and in the show he was simply a second son, so either way he stood to inherit nothing---not from his father and not from Corlys. Him putting forth the idea that the Velaryon boys were bastards wasn't motivated by anything more than greed: he wanted the power and wealth that came with Driftmark, and he was willing to do whatever he needed to to get it.

Corlys was the only one who really had a say in the succession, as he was its ruler and the one who built it to the great island that it was through his own wealth and power. And Corlys, in both the books and show, was steadfast in his succession: Laenor was to inherit Driftmark and then, after his death, Lucerys was to inherit Driftmark.

We're even shown, in the show, Rhaenys putting forth the idea that Driftmark should go to Baela and Rhaena, but Corlys keeps to his decision that Driftmark would've passed to Lucerys.

"The blood doesn't matter, only names, and they are Velaryons."

As @bluejayprime puts it in this post, Corlys isn't being metaphorical here: what matters to him is the name that Driftmark passes on to, not whether or not Lucerys is theoretically a bastard.

To put it plainly: disinheriting Lucerys in order to pass Driftmark on to Baela or Rhaena would mean that Driftmark would go from being Velaryon to Targaryen.

Names are passed down through the father---which is why Jace, Luce, and Joffrey are Velaryon and not Targaryen and why Baela and Rhaena are Targaryen and not Velaryon---which is why Corlys' and Viserys' conversation in S1 was so important.

Corlys was not asking Viserys- "will the throne be passed down through my blood?" -Corlys was asking Viserys- "will the throne be passed down through my name?"

AKA will the ruling house change from being the Targaryens to the Velaryons.

The compromise is that Jace will grow up under the name Velaryon, but once he ascends the throne he will be named a Targaryen.

The succession of Driftmark is operating under the same rules, if it gets passed down to Baela or Rhaena it will go from being under Velaryon rule to Targaryen rule---which is what Corlys cares about, and what he doesn't want happening.

Corlys doesn't want his house to lose power, not his blood. He does not CARE about blood, he cares about the prosperity of his house. And disinheriting Lucerys would do more to HURT his house than anything else, which is why he DOESN'T do it.

Could he theoretically have named Vaemond as his heir? Sure, but why should he have to? Corlys had a son who had a son, why should he be forced by another house to pass Driftmark down to his brother/nephew rather than his grandson?

Continuing with the other example I used, should House Lannister be able to force Ned Stark to pass Winterfell to Benjin rather than to Robb?

Again: they shouldn't!

And just like Benjin---a second son---doesn't get a say in who Ned names as his heir, Vaemond---the son of a second son/a second son---doesn't get a say in who Corlys names as his heir. If people other than the current head of the household get to have a say in their heir, everyone is going to start putting forth bastard accusations and claims to support their own wants...

...which is EXACTLY what we see with Vaemond and the Hightowers.

They ignore Corlys' CLEARLY STATED WISHES in order to disinherit his heir- (Lucerys) -and put forth someone who would support their own interests rather than who would actually be next in line- (Baela and Rhaena, because they come before Vaemond).

No matter how you look at it, Vaemond and the Hightowers have zero say in Driftmark's succession, and y'all can go cry about it.

Friendly reminder that these beautiful boys

are Princes of the realm and rightful heirs to the throne

There’s Driftmark discourse happening again and I am going to add my two cents in on the book version of events because I think the show, very obviously, had an agenda against the Velaryon boys (and the Dragon Twins 😒) in order to give Ryan Condal’s self-insert more ‘sympathetic’ moments.

The events happen as such: they are NOT at Driftmark for Laena’s funeral, instead they are there for Laenor’s. Baela and Rhaena are non involved. Aemond sneaks off to claim Vhagar. Joffrey spots him and attempts to stop him. Aemond shoves him into dragon shit and proceeds to claim Vhagar. The fight between the queen and princess’ boys commences.

Joffrey ran to get his brother’s help. Jacaerys and Lucerys came back with him, all three bearing wooden swords. They fell on Aemond with a “fury,” but Aemond was older and bigger than all three combined and fought back. He managed to disarm three year old Joff, break five year old Luke’s nose, and smash the wooden sword he’d taken against the back of six year old Jace’s head. All three boys scrambled to get away from him, as he had thoroughly beaten them. There is absolutely no mention of Aemond receiving injuries from this part of the encounter, despite describing what he did to the Velaryon boys and his being ‘outnumbered’ by apparent ‘equal’ opponents.

Aemond felt ‘big’ and ‘mighty’ after claiming Vhagar and successfully beating up his ‘bastard’ nephews and began to gloat at them. (which, remember, this isn’t the night of their estranged aunt’s funeral, it’s the night of their father’s funeral.) The only boy old enough to understand the insults being levied at them was Jace, who proceeded to fly at Aemond and very quickly began being beaten “savagely.” Once again Aemond, the much older and bigger boy, had BEATEN all three of his nephews. He didn’t stop, instead continuing to attack Jace. Luke grabbed his own dagger (meaning he’d had it the entire fight and not used it), came to the rescue of his brother, and slashed at Aemond’s face in an attempt to get him to stop.

What this obviously indicates is that, whether you think the Velaryon boys were valid or impetuous in their going after Aemond, Aemond won. All three boys were on the ground. The ONLY reason the (rather one-sided) fight continued is because he decided to start mocking them. The only one that went back in was Jace, and Aemond beat him AGAIN. We’re not told that he stopped beating him ‘savagely’ at any point. It cuts directly to Luke grabbing the knife he’d had the whole night and slashing (most likely wildly) at his face. The book verbatim says he “came to the rescue of his brother.” Luke is not some maliciously evil child who deliberately tried to maim his older uncle for life, he was a desperate kid trying to stop his brother from being hit repeatedly with no end in sight.

Even in the show it’s hard to take that viewpoint seriously. Sure, the boys are slightly older, and the Dragon Twins are involved, but Aemond is the one who tells Rhaena (a child he’s never met on the night of her mother’s funeral) that a pig would suit her to ride. He gains the upper hand against all four of them. He tells Jace and Luke, “You will die screaming in flames just as your father did,” and to all of them, “I’ll feed you to my dragon.” Mind you, at least three of these kids are actively grieving, Baela and Rhaena over Laena, and Jace over Harwin. There is nothing sane about this encounter.

You cannot cherry pick the scene and dialogue to your heart’s content just to victimize Aemond and villainize the Velaryon boys (because of blood status, mayhaps? tricky tricky). Did Aemond deserve to lose his eye? No. Did Luke intentionally try to take his eye? No. Was it an accident that could have very well been prevented if any fucking adult was near even one of those kids? Yes. The Velaryon boy’s are not “monstrous.” They certainly don’t grow up to commit atrocities left and right- oh, wait! We know precisely who goes on to do exactly that. Figures.

*enjoys it* *smitten af*

*knows her praise helps him* *brain shuts down*

wee Elphie scribble

Crazy how some people, in this day in age, still think Lucerys had shit to apologize for. Or deserved to be punished for cutting Aemond's eye. As if we don't have Aemond trying to kill Luke and his older brother filmed in 4k. Crazy how the term 'self defense' doesn't exist to them.

Crazy how people believe getting bullied gives Aemond an excuse to go around committing war crimes. Crazy how people still see Luke as the main bully instead of Aegon who clearly egged Luke on and came up with the pig thing himself. Also if you're a 14 year old getting bullied by a boy half your age, that's honestly just a skill issue.

Crazy how people still think Luke was a bad person for laughing at the pig at that stupid dinner, not being particularly nice to someone who once tried to strangle you is normal. Crazy how people think a CHILD briefly laughing at and making fun of an adult gives that adult an excuse to murder that CHILD in cold blood.

I know that all the greenies hate Luke and think he deserved to die for laughing at Aemond during the dinner scene....

But I think he was actually really funny for it

Seeing ppl hate on Lucerys is so funny to me bc you have beef with a CHILD who got 5 mins of screen time and then was done brutally wrong by the man half of ya’ll praise who is more of a “little shit” than Luke ever was.

pls pipe down 💀

Oh, this is just beautiful! A lovely tribute!

I love my queen Penelope she said "is it you or am I dreaming AGAIN?" there's no way she didn't hear the carnage happening just outside he door, so does that mean she... she had dreams of Ody returning home and straight up slaughtering everyone in his way???

God I love this woman. Our Spartan Queen. If she went to war instead of Odysseus the Troy would have fallen after a week