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not calliope colour

@lime-bloods / lime-bloods.tumblr.com

you're thinking of something more on the blue side.
worldbuilding and lit analysis blog. a lot of Homestuck

Homestuck's Gnosticism: The World / The Wheel

Everyone knows Homestuck is "a Gnostic story".

Wait, why does it feel like we've had this exact conversation before...?

AH. SO NICE OF YOU TO JOIN ME.

If you followed along with the first post in this series, you'll be familiar already with the Gnostic nature of Homestuck's central conflict between the spirit world and the flesh. And even if I say so myself, I think that post is pretty definitive; if you're ever unsure what a particular character's motivations or end goal are, the Conflict will tell you. But what's conspicuously absent from the post is any explanation of what actually happens in Homestuck. We've covered the why, but very little of the how.

I left us off on the "synonymous goals" that spring naturally from this conflict between flesh and spirit; attaining ultimate knowledge, and escaping the confines of Homestuck itself. Eagle-eyed readers probably spotted what was lying between the lines, there: the comic is called Homestuck because it's about being stuck in a house, so the ending is about escaping the house. But what does that really look like? And how did they get in that house in the first place?

Let's return very briefly to a quote I used in the previous post. "[Y]our ultimate self [...] unlike god tiers or bubble ghosts or whatever, it really IS immortal". Two assumptions naturally grow out of this fact. First, and probably most obvious: when John dies, he's not really gone. The idea of him still exists out there, somewhere, and in our minds, so he still exists. Second, though: if the idea of him is eternal, John obviously didn't start existing when he was born. So again we ask, where did he come from?

How did John get here? Where does he go? The answers to these questions are like the four sides of one hypercoin, in that Homestuck is a time loop... of a sort.

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i think it's interesting how ectobiology is being used as a symbol of the regressive and the repetitive; it is literally the science of "making babies out of ghosts", so in other words the art of remixing existing ideas over and over again (its literal main purpose in Sburb: creating multiple groups of slightly different kids, literally 'paradox clones', so it can attempt to reproduce the same way again and again until something works). Dirk thinks making a new species out of old ideas via ectobiology is the way for Homestuck to keep going forever. Jade thinks having a new kid without ectobiology is the one way to break the monotony, even if it's literally with one of the same eight people her family has been tied up with for the past 5000 years.

this does have further implications worth discussing when viewed through a queer lens. what does it say, for instance, that these characters appear to view pregnancy as the only way to have a "real" baby, and making a baby in a lab as the "fake" way? even Kanaya seems to echo this sentiment when she expresses resentment over her race having been forced to reproduce with machines. we have been talking a lot recently about how aspects of paradox space that may seem queer or liberating on first glance - quadrants, for instance - are actually just veiled tools of the patriarchy, and it's true that the same could be thought of ectobiology; for one thing, Sburb only seems interested in pairing men and women, even when they lack any sexual chemistry in reality. so maybe it is queer and liberating that Jade and Rose, by eschewing ectobiology altogether, have earned the place of being the first gay couple in Homestuck to make a baby together, breaking that streak. but because Homestuck^2 inherited by necessity the Epilogues' positions on sex and gender, which at times come across as deeply un-queer and un-liberating, it's also true that Jade and Rose have only been allowed that opportunity because of some fluke of their biology. nothing seems to have been truly liberated from the way it was before; if two people on Earth C want to have a kid regardless of their own biology, the very machines which are being painted as regressive seem to be the only option they currently have. and this has ramifications for the building of interspecies families just as much as it does nonheterosexual ones, which is a major concern not just for the subjects of Jane's xenophobic regime at large, but also for a great portion of Homestuck's own core cast

wow my first ever sincere analysis of hs2 now just a little over a year old... right now feels like a good time to revisit this too because this exact line of thinking has panned out in a really interesting way.

the birth of Jade and Rose's miracle gay baby was not queer or liberating because it was never about breaking a streak. the deceit of Yiffany's creation was carried out in the name of fulfilling what Jade was promised by Karkat and by Sburb when she was only 13 - the opportunity to start a family with her logical breeding partner Dave. we find things even worse than we suspected a year ago: Jade's sentiment is not merely for the process of procreation itself, but for the white picket, heterosexual nuclear ideal with which it is associated. indeed, Jade's justification for the subterfuge with her friend's wife - to create "a normal kid with a normal life", without the baggage of implied "abnormalcy" that comes with being a test tube ecto-baby - is the very same reason she now gives for sticking with a dying world: "the kids have a chance here, john. / to grow up like real people do and be... actually FUCKING normal!" Jade is driven entirely by this fixation on the "normal" life.

at the core of Jade's accusation, that John's idea of happiness "is just chasing after whatever it is you dont already have", is a hypocrisy. because what Jade is really fighting so hard to protect is the chance to live a life different to the one she was condemned to as a child. for Yiffany, a "normal life" is one without the burden of a celebrated deity for a mother and without people "fucking bark[ing] at her while walking down the street" - but for Jade, the "normal life" is just the one where she doesn't have to be all alone on an island. and she can't understand that the reason John wants so badly to escape that life is because the white picket fence was exactly the purgatory he was trapped in for all his youth.

when Beyond Canon positions procreation and pregnancy as "normal" and therefore in philosophical opposition to ectobiology, it is not to insinuate that what is "normal" is synonymous with what is "good": it's to establish the rock which sits opposite the hard place of Dirk's (and now John's) regressive way of thinking. the suburban fantasy Jade is trying to catch for herself by replicating the heterosexual familial structures she longed for as a child is just as fake as the heroism and cosmic destiny the Sburb-focussed parties are so obsessed with. ectobiology and "normal" biology are both perfectly valid tools for achieving the same end, neither intrinsically regressive or progressive on their own - it's the ideologies with which these tools are exploited which can lead to ruin. whether suburban or Sburban, dictated by a magical frog or by a long-dead father figure, the never-ending cycle of necessary destruction followed by necessary creation is a game you can only win by choosing not to play, and Jade and John are currently losing very, very badly.

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love transmasc terezi analysis [thumbs up emoji] i read her as tmasc nonbinary but that might be me reading too much into the way she often forces herself into binary choices to her detriment OR has them forced on her (heads tails symbolism, the game over timeline vriska choice, dave vs karkat as 'romances to pursue', and more recently the way she acts as outsider and agent to both rose and dirk in beyond canon, the two forces of progenitor masculinity and femininity on deltritus). i think it's interesting how she views servitude to the empire as aspirational and i think that is definitely got some gender stuff going on there given preexisting reads of the caste system as misogyny. if you'd ever like to expand more on terezi as transmasculine, i'd love to hear it!

i don't think you are reading too deep into anything lol once upon a time it was pretty standard to remark upon the pointed androgyny of terezi's design so idk why i was getting yelled at for pointing it out just now. I never thought to connect this to her role as balance-keeper though.. if you think about it even the fact that her coin is called a "Cae[s]ar" but depicts a female figure seems emblematic of the illusion of dichotomy it offers

I've mentioned before that in general I'm less interested in figuring out what a character 'is' than I am in identifying how they relate to and participate in gender as a hierarchy of power, so I don't know if I would call the following a "transmasculine" read of Terezi per se. But it is a read on how I think Terezi plays masculine gender roles, or - to be crude - 'role plays' as male. So I definitely think it lends itself to interpretation of Terezi as a character with a masculine or androgynous identity

Expanding on what I first tentatively approached in this post and briefly followed up with my (apparently controversially) vague commentary on Terezi's clothing, my conception of Terezi's relationship to gender is largely informed by her relationship to the Knight role, which she implicitly tries to emulate when she role-plays as Redglare (the Knight of Mind) and which - as we understand it via Dave - is tied up in all these gendered expectations of heroism. Her proximity to gendered/hemospectral power absolutely plays a part too, though: the heroic Knighthood Terezi enthusiastically associates with being a legislacerator (see: the 'back in the day we could just kill criminals on the spot' shit) is really just systemic violence she is allowed to participate in by the blueness of her blood. But what she's apparently blind to is that - as you say - participating in that violence is subjecting herself to the violence of those higher on the patriarchal hierarchy. It's obvious to us, viewing Redglare's story as a cautionary tale about Terezi's fate, that the legislacerator is little more than the Grand Highblood's slave in the form of an attack dog; meanwhile Terezi obliviously treats Gamzee like a fascinating little oddity to play her games with, and is thus totally blindsided when he flips the script on her and reminds her of her place. Masculinity is a pool she's thrown into the deep end of, and Gamzee holds her head under the water with a grin.

Latula's bizarre struggle with the 'cool girl' persona is just Terezi and Redglare's complex of empowerment-disempowerment magnified to the ridiculous. The 'cool girl' finds acceptance among male peers by shedding off those cultural residues of femininity which are seen as undesirable, but for all her efforts can never truly become 'one of the boys' - for her gender transgression she is placed simultaneously outside of and beneath both classes. The gag about Latula not wanting to be "left hanging" even positions failure to be recognised as 'cool' ('like a boy') as a matter of life and death!

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followed up my rewatch of Alien and Prometheus with Aliens on Thursday and Alien: Covenant on Saturday. given how closely Prometheus commits to being a straight-reinterpretation of the story of Alien, I felt primed for Covenant to be in some way a deconstruction of the sequel, and the film's opening act gave me ample reason to hold onto these expectations: where Aliens is an unashamed glorification of American heroes slaughtering communist guerilla monsters against all odds in Vietnam, Covenant is much more understated about its band of colonists landing on an unfamiliar world with slightly more assault weaponry than you think seems necessary for the job. but perhaps my hypothesis was coloured by the still-great theory that Avatar was James Cameron's apology for the crass implicit racism of Aliens, because Covenant quickly abandons any ideological qualms about colonising a planet which has already been agriculturally developed (don't worry, someone already killed off the entire indigenous population and the remaining wildlife is hostile enough to justify slaughter on sight - it's terra nullius!) - and maybe it would have been rude for Ridley Scott to have a go at someone else's movie like that, anyway.

i do think Covenant has some interesting developments to make on Prometheus' core theme of creator-versus-creation, though they're clumsily executed and go hand-in-hand with the franchise's struggle to come up with a horror prop that comes anywhere near to the effectiveness of the original facehugger. the whole film hinges on the line about humanity finding emotional androids unsettling and creating a more perfect soldier to replace it, and it's a great exchange, but as a whole the story fails to live up to the premise

I havent collected my thoughts completely. But I noted this opening line: "this development represents not Manhattan's increasing detachment from humanity, but rather an escalation of his ongoing objectification-as-woman." Wouldn't it be essentially the same though? If I understand this essay correctly, objectification and a "a sexy powerful" being in the shape of a woman go hand in hand. Wherein if object, then not woman/human. It's like that saying - angels have more in common with printers than people. Objects bear a function, and internally morally neutral, especially as they are devoid of human faults, especially missish ailments like emotions. as you later say: "a woman is 'allowed' to be a person or to be powerful, but never both simultaneously, because, crucially, a woman who is allowed to be a person makes mistakes." then jake at the height of his power, and objectified as a woman, would make him more object than person at this point? unless im like way off base

well pointed-out! don't worry, I think you got my point; the confusion is an ambiguity of wording on my part, but it's an ambiguity that serves well to illustrate the gendered colours of the point I'm making, so I'll go into it a bit.

Manhattan's apotheosis and woman's objectification absolutely are both forms of "detachment from humanity": the purpose of my distinguishing the two is that Manhattan's detachment is self-imposed. He deliberately removes himself from personhood by strict adherence to what might be best described in this context as rigidly masculine values: a suppression of emotional responses and total dedication to logic above all else - put another way, rigid adherence to 'objectivity'. The objectification-as-woman is in contrast pressed upon Jake by outside forces: though we observe that Jake is a highly emotionally-driven being, his feelings are necessarily stifled by external actors who seek to project their own desires unto him.

I should also point out that in generalising apotheosis-as-objectification I have engaged in a degree of willful conflation, between objectification-by-author or by-audience (external to the story) and objectification-by-characters (within the story). Rei is such a strong example of the all-powerful woman cliche in part because she is equally subject to both; her transformation into the Giant Naked Rei is essentially the successful completion of a lifetime of grooming into sexual and maternal object by Evangelion's various conspirators. But for Rose Tyler and Jean Grey, their objectification is only implicit; the minimisation of their human agency is not the agenda of a shadowy cabal but rather the simple result of living as human women in a patriarchal society. In this sense their apotheoses are almost in spite of objectification, rather than a logical extension of it (think again of Jake's powers flaring up the most dramatically when his emotional agency is stripped from him) - as I say, at least within Doctor Who's established paradigm of power, Tyler becoming the Bad Wolf is an act above her station. The Bad Wolf and the Phoenix's objectification is exterior to the text; a re-claiming of the powerful woman as sex object for male consumption, just as the mundanely powerful woman like Lara Croft is empowered within-text but objectified from without. To the point: I believe that Beyond Canon's reflective nature (and Homestuck's generally) puts it in the perfect position to tackle the history and tropes associated with objectification-by-audience using a character like Jake who has a history of being objectified by his fellow characters.

Watchmen, Issues #1-12; Homestuck, pp. 4167, 5585; Homestuck: Beyond Canon, p. 716

Naked White Jake is the fulfilment of something of an unspoken prophecy in Homestuck regarding a mustachio'd radioactive mutant. Like Manhattan, over the course of his life Jake's trousers have been shortening inevitably towards this point. But for Jake in particular, this development represents not Manhattan's increasing detachment from humanity, but rather an escalation of his ongoing objectification-as-woman. Specifically, I think the next chapter in Jake's story is to be an exploration of 'apotheosis' as a form of female objectification in fiction.

End of Evangelion (1997)

Beyond the superficially Manhattan, the most obvious cultural point of comparison for Jake's new form would seem to be the End of Evangelion's Rei Ayanami - colloquially dubbed the "Giant Naked Rei" by Evangelion commentators. The similarities are in more than just their pallid, luminescent, larger-than-life (be that figuratively or literally) and naked forms; pictured above, Rei caresses in her hands a meteorite which was at one time the birthplace of the human race and now acts as the womb toward which all human souls are drawn in order to be born again. The parallels to Jake's protection of the meteor in 8r8k - a meteorite from which the population of Earth C was born and toward which they seem to find themselves once more inescapably drawn - are obvious.

But it's not the literal events of the battle for the meteor that are necessarily most significant here; more relevant is what Rei represents as a cultural symbol. Rei's designated role throughout Evangelion is primarily as object, sexualised and maternalised both - sometimes simultaneously - and it is in her apotheosis as the Giant Naked Rei that this objectification reaches its logical extreme. Like Naked Jake - and in some ways like Doctor Manhattan, too - Naked Rei's transformation into Lilith places her at the furthest possible point from her own humanity, as a sheer force of nature. Within Evangelion's mythology, Lilith is essentially an artifact; she is called by female pronouns, but only on the technicality that she exists to facilitate this process of birthing and re-birthing. Within folklore, Lilith's role is hardly any more illustrious, an existence solely to submit to husband Adam's will and to mother his hundreds of children - but it's this lot in life that speaks particularly to Jake's own history of objectification.

(taking all that into account, the nurturing nature of Naked Jake's actions does strike me as worthy of comment. while all of Earth C appears subconsciously intent on claiming the meteor-egg at the center of the universe, Jake's actions are protective, even generative; I've commented already on how unintuitive it seems that his hope field causes angels to radiate outwards from the meteor when everything else is trying to impregnate it. he almost appears to go through the motions of performing acts which had previously belonged to the women on the battlefield: it's hard not to draw the link between his hope bubble and Jade's force field {which itself seems to call back to the "containment" dead Calliope set up for Earth C itself}, and the part he plays in Jade's revival had up until that point been solely the domain of Life-givers Jane and Meenah {who have their own long and complex relationships with motherhood}. Naked Jake's hope field is destructive, but only ever passively; his primary contribution to the battle's events is that of midwife.)

Doctor Who (2005), Series 1 Episode 13 "The Parting of the Ways"

A further point of comparison, which is less immediately apparent and has been far less widely discussed despite its broad cultural reach but I feel has equally significant potential ramifications, is to Doctor Who's Bad Wolf.

The gendered power dynamic between Doctor and companion is key to Doctor Who as a piece of art. By the very nature of the programme's structure she is disposable, interchangeable; and by the nature of the culture from which the story originates, the purpose of her existence teeters on the same precipice between emotional support and sex appeal that is usually occupied in our minds by the magician's assistant or the airline hostess. In reviving a 20th century concept for the 21st century it fell upon writers of modern sensibility to somehow make the programme's female deuteragonists just as 'special' as its male idol, and through the nadir of Doctor Who's relationship to gender politics (under self-proclaimed fetishist of "powerful, sexy women" Steven Moffat) this process came to be emblemised by the transformation of women with names into girls with titles. Following the example set by the prototypic "Girl in the Fireplace", "The Girl Who Waited" and "Impossible Girl" are stripped of human identity in order to sell their human identity: ascension to mythic status as the ultimate logical endpoint of the 'strong female character'.

Without delving too deep into all the nuances of Rose Tyler herself - who is just as worthy of being distinguished from the above examples as she is of being included among them, but this isn't quite the place for that essay - the Bad Wolf is easily identifiable as the genesis of Doctor Who's obsession with the (all-)powerful woman. Like Manhattan, Tyler is an ordinary human made unexpectedly omnipotent by exposure to exotic energy; but also like Manhattan, at least early in his life - and perhaps unlike the Giant Naked Rei - Tyler's actions as the Bad Wolf are still motivated by a recognisably human emotive impetus. Such it is that, even as-god, Tyler continues to be weighed down by the fetter of Doctor Who's intrinsically patriarchal dynamic: for a human (woman) to act above her station in such a way, by taking up the authority to control life and death which belongs traditionally to the Time Lords (gendered deliberately), could be not just her own undoing but the undoing of the whole (social) fabric of reality. The 'Bad Wolf' is referred to as if she/it is a separate entity from 'Rose Tyler' almost by necessity; a woman is 'allowed' to be a person or to be powerful, but never both simultaneously, because, crucially, a woman who is allowed to be a person makes mistakes.

Homestuck: Beyond Canon, p. 630

Jake's powers are - so like a woman, one might cynically add - intimately tied up in his emotions. A comparison perhaps more familiar to Homestuck's established repertoire of cultural touchstones would be the Jean Grey-Phoenix (two names which, very much like Rose Tyler and the Bad Wolf, have come over time to be used to refer to two distinct entities, out of fear for what it might mean for one human woman to wield such omnipotent power) of Christopher Claremont's Uncanny X-Men, whose transformation into cosmic force of nature goes hand-in-hand with her self-discovery as an independent, sexual woman. Significantly, Jake retreats into his own force-of-nature state seemingly in direct response to objectifying treatment. The hope field isn't just something he struggles to control; it manifests itself directly out of feelings of loss of control.

Though the explosion of energy that lays waste to Derse is the most dramatic manifestation of this retreat into hopelessness, Beyond Canon throws us hints at how these attacks can arise in less drastic, day-to-day scenarios: specifically, how Jake's "just wishing that [Tavros' nut allergy] would nix" causes it to disappear, completely by accident. Like Rose Tyler, Jake English is a character that the story has decided is simply too tiny-minded to comprehend the massive power he wields, and as a result he reacts to situations of misunderstanding and distress by simply warping the world into one that he does understand.

Beyond Canon, p. 716; Doctor Who, "The Parting of the Ways"

For the Bad Wolf, this shows itself in the resurrection of Jack Harkness. Gunned down only moments before, Tyler decides in her childish ignorance that he should be alive again, and the result is that Jack Harkness being alive becomes a fact of reality: just as Tavros will never experience another allergic reaction again, Jack is abandoned by the Doctor - who in all his patriarchal authority on the matters of life and death has decided his existence is a mistake - to live an eternity without ever knowing death.

Naturally we must then question the significance of Jake intervening in the same way in Jade's death. None of the same ambiguity surrounds Jade that has previously surrounded other victims of resurrection interference; having done little in the way of villainy, and being struck unceremoniously from afar by an unnamed gunman, there is little reason to believe Jade's death could have possibly been narratively significant enough to stick. So if the lack of clarity is not on our part, we have to assume it is on Jake's: what, then, are the possible repercussions of Jake bringing back from the brink of death someone whose circumstances he does not fully understand? If Rose's assessment is correct - that whether a god is deemed heroic or villainous depends on the internal judgement of their own complex and nuanced "moral grey matter" - what then are the potential ramifications of Jake praying that this moral grey matter be cured of what ills it?

What are the consequences of the apotheosis of the sex object?

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it's interesting to look at jane crocker's political career not always in terms of how it makes her a ""fascist monster"" so to speak - along the lines of homestuck's literal fascist monsters like the condesce and lord english - but in how it plays into the crucial fact at the heart of her character that she is "normcore". jane is a character of the context she was born in, the almost-exact midpoint of the barack obama presidency; superficially and popularly, a time of great optimism for a liberalising america, but through this facade of optimism a time which also saw a great deal of "normalisation" of deeply evil american imperialism both abroad and at home.

jane's love of the NBC's Parks & Recreation is emblematic of this. homestuck and parks & rec are similar in one respect, which is that p&r also began and ended over the course of the obama presidency - and like jane, p&r is deeply of that era. in many senses it is the ancestor to the "copaganda" of programming like Brooklyn 99 which took over its position of popularity into the trump era: at the core of its comic dynamic is the interplay between leslie knope, a progressive-liberal "girlboss" and champion of big government, and ron swanson, the hard-working, moustache-toting libertarian sentinel of private capitalist interest. but in the classic mode of liberal american thought, the core message of the show is that these two characters are friends. despite the complete incompatibility of their respective ideologies, the two must work together and make compromise at every stage, ensuring that the political landscape of america - implicitly the perfect state - never changes or progresses from where it is now. and it's telling that, despite being the liberal "girlboss" with visions of political ascendancy, jane's love and admiration is for the male character. like obama himself, swanson serves to put a friendly, sometimes goofy but always loveable face on american patriarchal hegemony.

because by the time homestuck had closed up and the post-canon had opened america had crossed that threshold from obama's presidency into the next, it's impossible not to draw parallels between jane's descent into xenophobia and the overt isolationism of the trump republican administration. but i think putting jane on this trajectory is also in a very real sense just as much an indictment of the democrat majority of homestuck's genesis; xenophobia is not a "trump problem" but rather an AMERICA problem, and in fact the political landscape of the late 2010s and 2020s is an inevitable progression of the kind of politics that were considered "normal" in 2011, not the result of some freak misstep of electoral probability in 2016.

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it's hard not to think hussie was maybe making some kind of commentary on the demographic of many of his readers by making jane a problem sleuth fan also. like even the part where she says "comics aren't really her thing" despite having a poster of dr manhattan on her wall

like i've commented on this before in the contrast between dave and calliope but you'll notice that in act 1 the character representing "mspaintadventures readers" was like an esoteric hipster who listens to weird music and is responsible for sweet bro and hella jeff then in act 6 the character who reads mspaintadventures is a suburban white girl heiress who watches parks and recreation and is so glad hussie just kept making more of the same comic instead of experimenting

in Problem Sleuth, the rule is that for a demon to escape a black hole, an angel has to fall back in - or vice versa. I made this allusion back when Vriska was still stuck in the Plot Point, but I recognised then that this seemed like an unlikely direction for Beyond Canon to go in, and the events of 8r8k largely reinforce this feeling; the animation is about convergence, rather than divergence. (perhaps Vriska's angel- and devil-selves have merged into a demigoddess, instead?) but there are still a few crumbs I feel are worth taking note of. firstly, that 8r8k seems to be at least playing with the iconography of angels radiating from a black hole:

secondly; I now think the Plot Point storyline actually sets (Vriska) up as a symbolic angel? the segment opens with this kind of offbeat callback to Jaspers' tomb...

...which employs a trifecta of symbols that malo already figured out years ago - cats are angels are babies. but page 666 plays in this space in its own unique ways, too, frequently reiterating that the sprites and other hell-ghosts are eternal children. within the example set by Davepetasprite, the sense is that Vriska's eternal child-self must also be her angel-self.

(I also can't shake the feeling that the allusion to Jaspers' tomb - especially keeping in mind that it's Roxy herself who engineered one-half of the Plot Point* - is supposed to put us in the frame of mind of burying a child: that (Vriska) has to be buried for Vriska to ascend, in the same way I previously suggested an eight ball would have to be "sunk" to end the session? but it could be that I have things the complete wrong way around, and that the point is to exhume the child, as Rose does - if what follows is the "8r8k", then an eight ball is being set free rather than sunk? after all, Vriska's transformation also comes with being liberated from parenthesis!)

far more than vague symbols, though, there's one thing that page 666 directly calls attention to but which doesn't yet seem to have been paid off: the two-Nepeta problem.

right before Vriska comes face to face with herself, she calls attention to the fact that there are two Nepetas, and as a result one of them is whooshed away back to irrelevance. so what was that all about? if this hanging thread suggests the hatching of the meteor isn't necessarily the end of the Plot Point story thread, does it suggest, as I speculated previously, that the ascension of one Vriska means the descent of another? and so long as I am speculating: how sure can we be that a Twin Peaks scenario hasn't happened, and that the Vriska who 'ascended' is the one we think it was? Hell Tier Vriska's costume prominently evokes (Vriska)'s red belt and tall boots; is that because Vriska has come to accept (Vriska)'s existence, or because the new Vriska is Vriska? or maybe the distinction just isn't important anymore, like the 8r8k seems to be trying to tell us.

*if we can still think of Meenah as Roxy's doppelganger, it's hard for all of this not to be coloured by the fact that (Vriska) is Meenah's own 'little girl', too, even if it is in a slightly different way to the way that Jaspers is Roxy's 'little girl'... (though malo once argued that these things are more connected than they are distinct.) considering the consistent emphasis on (Vriska)'s youth and the vivid canny with which page 666 addressed Vriska's relationship to Doc Scratch, it would be an odd choice at this point to not ever address the situation with Meenah, especially now that the latter has risen to such a prominent role in the cast. the way Vriska subtly slips into the role of her own abuser over the last four years in the Plot Point only places emphasis on the lingering unease behind the whole thing. setting (Vriska) free for a bit could be one way to do that, though a merged Vriska could just as easily have the same confrontation.

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8r8k has a really interesting thread running through it about busting dichotomies, especially as they pertain to vriska's past (naturally); when Jake apparently 'intervenes' in Jade's resurrection process it evokes the ambiguity surrounding Vriska's own resurrection, and as the bullet flies toward Rose we see an adult Terezi reenacting her iconic coin flip:

the flip is always symbolic of two timelines - one clean and one scratched, one where you live and one where you die - and the scar running through Venus' head makes it clear which one Rose is supposed to be living in. but Vriska's intervention throws all that out the window. the split is no longer clear cut.

others have already pointed out that Vriska's hatching from the meteor removes the brackets which usually distinguish Candy-volume commands from Meat-volume commands - busting down even the distinction between the relevant and the irrelevant, just as was Calliope's plan for the Plot Point from the beginning!

(which also explains the strange interlude before the animation featuring GC - whose typing quirk, which was used to advertise the flash prior to its upload date, involves bombs surrounded by parentheses)

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when page 666 was still in progress I engaged in some idle speculation regarding the Plot Point and the black hole from Problem Sleuth which splits angels into ANGEL/ANTIANGEL PAIRS. even at the time I realised that splitting Vriska up into even more Vriskas would be totally antithetical to Beyond Canon's mission, but still the idea of a "demon" Hell Tier Vriska bursting from the Plot Point remained interesting. and I'm not totally convinced that 8r8k isn't evoking this in some way, with Jake's swarm of angels being born from the hope sphere right before Vriska hatches?

anyway, Jake imbuing the pure potential of his Hope into the meteor which is a symbolic womb is a potent image. but in this case the spermlike angels swim away from the egg, against the flow of soldiers trying to wriggle their way towards it? hm.

even the name of the animation, 8r8k, has special significance, because the Break is the name given to two separate but interconnected events within Homestuck. the first is the "8r8k H34DS" which signifies Lord English breaking his way out of his cueball egg and into the universe - remember that Vriska encountered (Vriska) inside an eight ball:

and the second, or rather "First 8r8k", seems worthy of mention because it occurred when Skaia became so heavy and black that it collapsed into a black hole - the resulting explosion creating Caliborn's fifteen billiard ball planets, referring to the "break" that first scatters the balls across a billiards table.

Alien is such a fantastic film... I was entranced by the way the sets on board the Nostromo are just as unfamiliar to the viewer as the sets aboard the alien ship, allowing the xenomorph to blend in among human technology just as easily as it blends in with the Gigeresque machinery it was born from - backgrounding the mirroring of the android and the xenomorph (the way Ash literally tries to kill Ripley by forcing something down her throat!) - until it seems to literally become part of the ship in the climax!

watching Prometheus back-to-back with its predecessor (and in the wake of Ripley's totally bankrupt rehash of Gladiator, which to disclaim I have yet to see [though I have rewatched the original recently enough to reaffirm its quality]) only highlights how much of a poor man's version of this that the sequel is. beyond the beat-for-beat reruns of Alien's iconic plot elements, the heavyhanded themes of creator-meeting-creation seem to serve only to make the original film's subtext into text - yes, the xenomorph is just like one of man's own creations.

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do you have any thoughts on rifles in homestuck. there's a lot of rifle wielders in homestuck, but i can't really see a throughline with those characters or any major things a rifle represents. with most other weapons i at least have some idea what they represent and what they say about a character but not so with rifles

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i can't say i've ever thought about this to the degree that it seemed like rifles had some persistent symbolic significance throughout the comic, no. Jake and Eridan sharing in being Heroes of Hope and both wielding firearms seems like a pretty obvious hint at guns as tools of colonial oppression, reinforced by Caliborn's gun literally doubling as a badge-of-office in the form of a king's scepter.

I would have said Roxy and Jade's rifles are basically tangential to Jake's, their both being his proteges in one or way or another, which is not a good answer if you're looking to semantically define a rifle as a symbol. but the frequent reminders in Jade's narration that using a gun was her grandpa's idea, and the way her taxidermy roleplay focuses on the urge to get a bigger gun and the fact that she can't even carry Jake's would seem to pretty straightforwardly position the guns in Jade's life as artifacts of masculinity on a similar level to the tests of strength in John's childhood. which might lend itself to explaining the little pistols baby Jake uses in lieu of a blunderbuss (though even the 2xpistols are quickly compared to the weapons used by a Tomb Raider and are thus symbolic of Jake's defiling of hallowed tombs).

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Meenah's use of Roxy as a coercive surrogate is a reenactment of her mentor Scratch performing the same trick on Rose with the Tumor. understanding that the Matriorb and the Tumor aren't just thematic and visual mirrors of each other but in fact serve the very same function in Rose and Roxy's mirrored arcs, though, we can identify another way in which Meenah becomes a symbolic player in the Lalonde family trauma; Meenah's also perpetuating a trick that Scratch once pulled on her!

(p. 4995)

Meenah having rejected motherhood early on in her Beforan life, when Scratch made sure her session was unwinnable and thus forced a reset, he was essentially setting up an elaborate scam ensuring that her quest leads up to this moment where she's forced to hatch a big troll egg. but where Rose hatching the Tumor was a "suicide mission" intended primarily to ensure her own destruction (with twin Dave coming along as collateral), Meenah sets the bomb off with the aim of ensuring her whole team's rebirth - setting up her new life post-scratch, she's forced to symbolically take on the role of mother to all trollkind (a burden which will only be lifted from her millennia later, with her death and the passing of the Tumor-in-Matriorb-form over to Kanaya).

while we can ascribe Meenah's late arrival to the dream bubbles to the temporal whims of the Furthest Ring, or even to the obscure motivations of the Horrorterrors responsible for them, having made the connection between Tumor and Matriorb it also brings to mind the immense spans of time it can take for troll genes to make their way through the incestuous slurry and finally be born, millennia after their ancestors have died. in fact the chronology of Dave and Rose's ascension even seems to hint at this same concept in action; while the pair presumably ascend instantaneously on their slabs the moment the bomb goes off, Aradia waits for some time at the pre-existing Sun for them to actually emerge from its surface, still engulfed in the flames that destroyed them. the Green Sun/incestuous slurry is like the Furthest Ring itself - they are mediums without a conventional flow of time, entry into which is not necessarily a reliable indicator of when you'll get out.

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