User talk:Klein Muçi

Welcome! And explanation of the redirect template

Hello, Klein Muçi! Welcome to Wikivoyage.

To help get you started contributing, we've created a tips for new contributors page, full of helpful links about policies and guidelines and style, as well as some important information on copyleft and basic stuff like how to edit a page. If you need help, check out Help, or post a message in the travellers' pub. New users are also welcome to post any questions or concerns to the arrivals lounge. If you are familiar with Wikipedia, take a look over some of the differences here.

For your information, if you're editing on desktop, there are a number of commonly-used templates at the bottom of the edit window. Among them is the template for creating a redirect: #REDIRECT[[]]. Just put the name of the page you want to redirect to in between the double brackets.

If you know about Albania, please feel free to help us grow our travel guide content on that country. All the best, ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 13:05, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

@ThunderingTyphoons!: hello! Thank you for your help as I was having difficulties using the visual editor because I mainly edit the source code on articles when I'm working. I'm an admin at the Albanian Wikipedia and Wikiquote and was dealing with the article about Albania in the Albanian Wikiquote, trying to create a template link with Wikivoyage. I saw Shqipëria and Albania weren't connected here and I thought I could help. One of our user groups has actually arranged a meeting to take place on August focusing on Wikivoyage in which we're hoping of having an editathon regarding Albania's and Kosovo's touristic spots, getting out of the incubator the Albanian version of Wikivoyage and raising awareness about the whole Wikivoyage project. I also enjoy traveling myself so I'll try to help here. Thank you for welcoming me! :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 13:21, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Sounds great! We have very few contributors from southeastern Europe. Warm welcome from me as well. --Ypsilon (talk) 15:09, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

@Ypsilon: thank you! It's always good to know some people where you can rely on when starting on a new project. :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 15:24, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

If you're planning to also target the English Wikivoyage with your Albania editathon, be sure to tell the community about it at our Travellers' pub; this should drum up some interest and prompt some help from existing Wikivoyagers. Other language versions have similar meeting/announcement pages too - depending on how multilingual you guys are, of course :-) Anyway, good to have you on board. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 15:44, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

@ThunderingTyphoons!: I will, thank you a lot! @Arianit: maybe you are interested in the conversation too. I hope I'm pinging the right Arianit. XD @Margott: you might wanna take a look too. :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 16:15, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Faleminderit shumë!

Thank you for helping to improve Wikivoyage's Albania and Kosovo articles. Your contributions will help readers who are thinking about travelling to Albania and Kosovo, and those who are planning trips there. I hope you can continue to help improve these articles. Ground Zero (talk) 10:26, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

@Ground Zero: thank you! :D It was fun. I hope the same. Happy editing! :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 11:43, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

Special:Diff/4627082

Was this an SWViewer misclick? Don't see what's wrong with adding a literal translation or stating what's the largest German city without any railways. --SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 10:31, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

SHB2000, hello! Generally I am wary of edits that come from new users that focus mostly on number changers without providing any sources whatsoever. If they're sneaky vandalism, they tend to stay around for much time until they're caught. Glad you could check it. :-) — Klein Muçi (talk) 10:48, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Not a problem. In ObersterGenosse's case, though, they have over 4000 edits on dewiki, but yeah, I can see why you'd think that (I'd have thought the same if this were to happen on Wikipedia). SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 10:52, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

SHB2000, hmm, I wasn't sure if the users' contributions options on SWViewer were related to local or global ones. Apparently they are local because otherwise I wouldn't have gotten such an edit. I'm not sure how I feel about this. — Klein Muçi (talk) 10:57, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Oh, so should I have provided some source? Or was it really a wrong click as you stated on Talk:Germany? What could I have done differently in order not to get reverted? What do you mean with "local" or "global" and what is up with SWViewer? Despite many edits on Wikipedia, I haven't heard about this "viewer" I am German myself and had looked up the largest town without a railway station on the internet and its population on Wikipedia, admittedly. ObersterGenosse (talk) 12:20, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

ObersterGenosse, I am currently with a phone but will get back to you with a thorough answer about everything that you ask as soon as I get into a PC, in around 1-2 hours. — Klein Muçi (talk) 12:25, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

@ObersterGenosse, hello back! So, SWViewer is a web app that basically gives its users a continuous stream of edits in the WMF projects which are to be checked in, more or less, a "mechanic manner". An edit comes to your screen, if you think it is okay, you just ignore it and go on to the next edit, if you think it is not okay, you press "rollback" and the changes get rolled back and the next edit comes into view. Repeat ad infinitum. You can find more information on this link and give it a try yourself as that will allow you to better understand why such an edit might have happened by my side. (Maybe you even decide to stay and help with it. Just be bold! :D )
SWViewer has many preferences which can be customized at your liking which determine what kind of edits are you interested in supervising. Two of those preferences are these:

Edits limit
The number of edits after which edits of a user will be skipped.
Days limit
Account age in days after which edits of a user will be skipped.

For me those values are 100 edits and 5 days. Now normally, those 2 preferences would have made sure by my side that your edits wouldn't show for me to supervise there as, like user SHB2000 said, you are an experienced user that has far more than 5 days of experience in total. You have more than 4000 edits globally (that means the very total of all your edits in all WMF projects like Wikipedia, Wikivoyage, etc.) which is obviously way beyond 100 edits. But they still showed. The reason for that is because apparently SWViewer considers the local values, not the global ones. In Wikivoyage you have less than 5 days activity from your first edit here and less than 100 edits so from the tool's perspective you are treated as a new user. Unfortunately there are many times when new users come and just change numbers in articles like dates and other cyphers randomly, just for vandalistic reasons. Considering that we have to "judge at a glimpse" while using SWViewer, that was enough in my eyes to consider rolling back your changes because they appeared too close to the typical vandalistic behavior I just explained. This was apparently a wrong decision by me because your edits were indeed correct.

What could I have done differently in order not to get reverted?
I believe if you could have included a short summary of the sort "updated this from the source founded here" would have been enough to not fit the typical vandalistic behavior as vandals rarely provide legitimate summaries.

I'd be glad to answer any other questions you might have. But I believe things will be clearer once you decide to give a small try to SWViewer yourself. — Klein Muçi (talk) 14:20, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

The thing is... I did change a number, yes, but I also edited other things, too. Does that not show on SWViewer? ObersterGenosse (talk) 14:36, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation! That is very helpful! ObersterGenosse (talk) 14:36, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

ObersterGenosse, yes, they showed. That is my wrong decision. I would dare say that unfortunately such wrong decisions can happen rather often with SWViewer, especially when you're just starting, because of the nature of the app. You are urged to act fast in languages you don't necessarily understand or on topics which you don't necessarily know much about (even on scripts you can't read). In this case, what stood aside in my eyes was the number change and some other minor changes which didn't hold much meaning to me given that I don't understand German so they were, wrongly, ignored. In these gray cases, I usually roll back because users will get notified that their changes were rolled back and if I've done an error, they will insist and redo them. After that happens, I tend to skip them. On the other side, vandals sometimes get scared that they "got caught" and don't insist after the first time.
If you check the SWViewer's talk page on Meta you will see that I have asked for some new features about it and one is related to mental health. That one tries to make editing in it less mechanical which would help in better judgement to hopefully minimize such cases from happening in the future. — Klein Muçi (talk) 15:29, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Ah, thanks for the explanation. I was a little scared that I would get called out for "edit warring" (like in Wikipedia - one shouldn't revert a revert) and thus tried to establish a consensus on the talk page (like I would do in Wikipedia). Everything is good now, or as one might say in German: Nichts für ungut. ObersterGenosse (talk) 18:07, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Actually, it is quite strange that my account/edits still showed up since it has definitely been far longer than five days since my first edits on en.Wikivoyage. I don't have 100 edits though, that is right. ObersterGenosse (talk) 18:17, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

ObersterGenosse, I usually follow 3RR, giving myself the liberty to revert back a revert once with a summary like "Unexplained revert" or something similar before resorting to talk page discussions.
That's interesting... I didn't know that aspect but SWViewer has been known to be prone of such problems in the past. Its settings tend to not work in conjunction with each other. There is already a bug report about something similar ([BUG]: "Language set" doesn't work when "small wikis" and/or "additional wikis" are enabled). Apparently none of the preferences work in conjunction with each-other. I will report this one as well. Would you might commenting there about your experience after I file up the bug report? — Klein Muçi (talk) 18:33, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Report filed at m:Talk:SWViewer. — Klein Muçi (talk) 18:43, 3 March 2023 (UTC)