Kruusamägi

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Please cite sources

Hello Kruusamägi, after I had encountered some of you edits on articles where you had added text without citing any sources for it, I took a look at you edit history. I was baffled by the fact that even though you have been here for quite some time, you still do not include proper references for your edits. Or if you do they are just bare urls. While your photos are great and your style is good, it is absolutely necessary that you also include info about where you have obtained the facts, otherwise you just leave behind a lot of work for other editors who have to do the adding for you. Please read the Help:Referencing for beginners if you are uncertain about how to do this. Best, w.carter-Talk 10:22, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

Thous few articles that I've made are in English Wikipedia are mainly shortened versions of articles from Estonian Wikipedia (like Jaan Künnap or Urmas Tartes) or exact translations (like 100 great Estonians of the 20th century or Harku Manor). Normally it is nearly impossible to find any references to sites that are written in English + some information can't be referenced to a web page as this is from other sources + some of the source articles in et wiki didn't also had any references. I have not used bare URLs for sure, but I do avoid templates because I consider thous a total waste of time + we've had so many problems with the use of templates in Estonian Wikipedia, that I am somewhat allergic to them by now (some years ago one user transferred a great bunch of templates from English Wikipedia, that means it now possible to just copy-paste references from English Wikipedia without checking them + new user are too eagered to use thous, but they don't fill in any fields and create a total mess with templates).

And about thus references. If I have written a ref in way like "Climbing the Ararat 180 years after Parrot", then how exactly is this url "bare"? Or what else there is to add (check link do see yourself)? If I do add references, then thous have enough information with them. Ivo (talk) 12:04, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

I'm glad that you took the time to answer. I am aware that many other Wikipedias have some serious problems, I myself come from the Swedish Wikipedia where there are issues similar to the Estonian. On the EngWiki there are so many ways that you can leave references, they do not have to be in English, they can be from books (those are actually preferred), journals, encyclopedias and all kind of sources. You can find them all at Category:Lua-based citation templates. When you use sources that are not in English you can leave the title in Estonian as is done in this article: Anija. It is even better to add the parameter |trans_title= | to the reference, where you provide a translation of the title, like I have done with the Swedish tiles in this article: John Bauer (illustrator). For an explanation about the bare ulrs, there is a guide here: Wikipedia:Link rot. As to the ref you provided, per WP:MOS which states how articles should be written, that should be something like this:

<ref>{{cite web|last=Tammiksaar|first=Erki|title=Climbing the Ararat 180 years after Parrot|url=http://www.muuseum.ut.ee/tuur/f1/eng.txt|website=www.muuseum.ut.ee|publisher=Tartu Ülikooli muuseum|accessdate=8 February 2015}}</ref>

Resulting in:

References

For translating articles from other Wikipedias, this is an answer I gave at the Teahouse on a similar question some time ago:

• WPs in different languages have very different rules and standards. Articles and facts that are good to publish on one WP are not automatically OK for other WPs. That said, the English WP have one of the highest standards for articles among the WPs, so most articles that you find here could be considered on other WPs.

• If you translate texts from one WP you must also "bring along" the references for that text. If the text in the original language is unreferenced, you must find references yourself to support the text you have translated. Some WPs allow references in a foreign language, other prefer not to have them. You must ask this at the WP in the language you are planning to translate articles to. Most WPs have something similar to the Teahouse where you can ask. (Some of the are called "Cafés") A translators role on the WP is very different from translators in other places. When you translate a piece of text to a WP, you become responsible for that text in the same way as if you have written it yourself, you can't blame the first editor who wrote it if anything is wrong in it.

• You must put a template on the articles talk page about the translation. These templates should contain information about what article version the text is collected from and which version on the other WP that it is inserted to. See Template:Translated page, and here it is used on one talk page translated to the English WP. It is the small box with two flags. This is so that the editors that originally wrote the text get credited. There are similar templates/boxes on the WPs in other languages.

I think that about covers it. Looking at some more Estonian articles, I saw that most of them had the same problem with the references, no doubt inherited from the Estonian Wikipedia. I have a friend here at the EngWiki who writes articles about Estonian things, I can refer you if you have some specific Estonian questions. Best, w.carter-Talk 13:04, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

I would actually even say that we have higher standards in et wiki than there are in en wiki (example: exact translation of FA from English would have very limited chance of getting even QA status). But due to the small number of editors it is very hard to provide constant quality and very high % of articles are work in progress.

This translation template is somewhat in disgrace in et wiki and we actually have rather few exact translations anyway.

I have no plan to learn the local templates in en wiki and this is one of the reasons why I have made so few edits in here over the years. People who are more familiar with it can do it much more easily. It's not that I am aiming for QA-s or anything. More like filling in some empty blanks with short articles to have at least something in a topic. Ivo (talk) 13:47, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

The rules are exactly the same for all articles her, be they stubs or FAs. It's just that this WP too have too many editors who are unwilling to make the effort of treating every article with respect, saying like you do that that's how you're used to do things and I will continue to do so regardless of the rules. Very few editors know Estonian and cannot fill in the missing parts the way you can. w.carter-Talk 14:00, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

Ooo, I know the rules. It is just that the ideal article and reality are two separate things. You got to start from somewhere and I would argue that a decent sub article is far better than the lack of it. Now naming the references I have made as "bare url-s" is something I would not agree in any position. Saying that I don't treat my articles in a good manner ... well, I would not agree on that one either. And there are actually quit a many Estonians around in this WP version. Finding additional sources isn't a thing that only I can do.

I'm also not saying that citing sources should not be done etc. It's just that I'm never going to contribute much to en wiki, as I don't see any good reason to study the local way of doing things (aka templates). I know perfectly well on how to do stuff in et wiki, but doing the same things here would require too much learning. It is easier to just avoid editing in this wiki and that's what I have done for most of nearly 9 years I have been around in WP.

Stating that I have responsibility to make thous articles perfect is just foolish. And it's also not like that I have translated some articles without taking references with them. In many cases I added new references to the source text in the process i.e. reworked the et wiki article. Ivo (talk) 19:10, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for your response. We clearly have very different ideas about how to improve the English Wikipedia. All the best, w.carter-Talk 19:21, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

I guess that any contribution that helps towards building a better encyclopedia is a good thing. Kind regards, Ivo (talk) 22:32, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

DYK

Hello! Your submission of Tartu Ülikool 350 at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Philafrenzy (talk) 23:02, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

DYK for Tartu Ülikool 350

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:30, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

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"Light pollution"

I reverted it because the picture had nothing to do with the article. No where in the article does it talk about light pollution. If you want to add info about light pollution within the article (with sources) and then add an image of it, that would be fine. But if you're just going to add a random picture in the lead with no talks of it in the article, it doesn't belong. Also, the content of the caption wasn't the best. I mean, just because light pollution interferes with an astronomical viewing, isn't the best way to convey light pollution. Take a look at the second image in the light pollution article. That image of New York would be a much better image to use to convey light pollution. Vaselineeeeeeee (talk) 16:16, 13 December 2015 (UTC)

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Truth and Justice (2019 film)

Hi. Please see Template:Infobox_film#Image - simply upload a new image over the existing file, and please do not edit war. Thank you. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 07:07, 3 June 2020 (UTC)

You continue to edit war. Please stop. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 10:41, 3 June 2020 (UTC)

I'm following the general guidelines. That file should be deleted based on speedy deletion criteria. You have no right to revert that. Ivo (talk) 10:44, 3 June 2020 (UTC)

June 2020

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