Talk:Pine Tree Flag

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old talk

Is it known as to why the tree depicted is a pine tree? If so, perhaps that should also be posted. Andersr9 (talk) 15:23, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think it has something to do Liberty Trees, though the original was an Elm. --70.119.12.223 (talk) 21:06, 11 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have read that this flag predates the revolution by as much as a century. The tree represents the timber industry, which was the principle export from the Massachusetts Bay Colony. Makes sense to me. Massachusetts was valued by the British for their timber used in shipbuilding. 20:00, 13 March 2017 (UTC) -- Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.102.213.18 (talk)

2021

Why is it deemed significant to state the flag was flown during the 2021 Attack on the Capitol? What is the author trying to imply? And it's been flying ever since.... The flag has been flying for centuries. 74.190.22.98 (talk) 01:19, 11 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This Wikipedia article properly concerns all cultural and historical aspects of its subject. Thus it consists not only of historical information about the original uses of the flag, but also includes the evolution of the flag over time. Over the past several years, it has become a visible symbol in current political discourse. As it is relevant in our contemporary milieu, it is therefore appropriate that content regarding that stays in the article. As an apt illustration, please refer to the extensive discussion of modern usage found in the Wikipedia article for another historical flag, the Gadsden Flag.--Fathomharvill (talk) 02:38, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

However, the Pine Tree flag is not remotely as prominent as the Gadsden Flag as a far-right symbol... AnonMoos (talk) 06:06, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The flag is currently being flown around the country as a symbol of support for the insurrection. This is why the fact that it was flown while storming the Capitol is important. Odoketa (talk) 15:23, 15 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Image

Is it weird that the image for this article is something someone apparently made in MS Paint? 50.108.199.141 (talk) 21:19, 7 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's an SVG. The photo File:Flag - Museum of the Ancient and Honorable Artillery Company of Massachusetts - IMG 6907.JPG looks somewhat the same, except the lines are more jagged... AnonMoos (talk) 23:15, 8 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Recent Events regarding it being used at Judge's house

For some reason we have decided to add that this flag was used at the, January 6 United States Capitol attack and that it was shown at a Supreme Court Judge's house. It being used at the attack only came to light after it was shown at a Supreme Court Judge's house.

This violates WP:RECENTISM, it only seems to be popping up because of a supreme court case coming up and will lose any relevance after. The fact that it being used at January 6 United States Capitol attack only showing up after the news about it being used at a Supreme Court Judge's house proves that it doesn't belong in this article. It maybe relevant to other articles like Samuel Alito but not here. 99.126.127.19 (talk) 22:41, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also, I see my change posted twice in the edit history. I was trying to preview and post, not going on an edit war. 99.126.127.19 (talk) 22:43, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Disagree. Sure it's news, but it's also yuge news. Drmies (talk) 00:55, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It might be big news, but does it have enduring importance to the subject to be included in an encyclopedia article on this flag? Doubtful. It’s more likely to be relevant to the associate Josie’ justice’s article or Fischer v. United States, though I think that’s premature too. — JFHutson (talk) 01:29, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Jfhutson, you just added Johnson to the article, albeit with a bare URL. Drmies (talk) 16:30, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Johnson was already in there, but with no explanation that he has used it since before it was used by far-right groups. I added clarification (and sorry, I was away from my computer so used a bare url).-- JFHutson (talk) 18:56, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is my thought. It is also important to Samuel Alito not to this flag. The numerous other flags used at the capital attack which I am guessing they used every revolutionary flag, do not have this mentioned Edit: nevermind of course the Gadsden flag was but just because some supreme court justice had it hanging, now it gets added.

It bares little WP weight. The importance will be less than a footnote a year from now. Only current events give it importance. 99.126.127.19 (talk) 02:28, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not convinced. If anyone wants to improve the article, they should tone down on the history of pine trees and Locke, and instead focus on adding directly verified material verified by proper secondary sources. I'm looking at articles like this, Monsky, John R. (2002). "From the Collection: Finding America in Its First Political Textile". Winterthur Portfolio. 37 (4): 239–264.. Drmies (talk) 16:30, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

ok this is getting ridiculous, we are now mentioning it as a right ring extremist flag, not even the Gadsden flag gets that label. We are well over overboard including the claim that it fell into "obscurity". I am just gonna wait until this dies down and comeback. I think there are parts that may merit inclusion like the Christian nationalism link holds a long term weight but I think this is why WP:RECENTISM exist. It is a hot event and people are just throwing in what they want. 99.126.127.19 (talk) 02:39, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"We" are not mentioning it as that; "we" are citing two reliable sources that indicate that in some circles it's linked with various movements. No, people are not "throwing in what they want"--people used to throw in what they wanted, and JFHutson has done a great job weeding out a bunch of trivial and unverified material. Drmies (talk) 16:30, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just to be clear I'm compromising by not removing Alito and Johnson while deleting poorly sourced stuff. I think they too should be removed based on RECENTISM, but I thought we should get consensus on the talk page first. -- JFHutson (talk) 18:59, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Including Alito and Johnson does not pass the WP:TENYEARTEST. -- JFHutson (talk) 19:01, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maine

I live in Maine and there's a big movement here to restore the original Maine flag. This can easily be confused with that flag. I, myself, thought at first that it was about the Maine flag. I strongly recommend adding a "not to be confused with the Flag of Maine (1901–1909)" notice at the top of this page. I'd do it myself but I only know how to use the talk page and basic edits, not advanced stuff so I don't want to screw anything up. GamerKlim9716 (talk) 04:56, 24 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]