Talk:Subways of Your Mind

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Songs

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it's real, change the name

everything is real, stop calling it unknown, it's FEX - Subways of your Mind, call it the The Most Mysterious Song on the Internet, but stop edit it to unknown — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gsdgsdf (talk • contribs) 15:35, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

While I agree, I'm fairly certain that we need to have secondary and teriary sources to back it up before the change is made. When we get those, as well as further information, we can change it. Also, there's apparently a live recording now? Might want to make a note of that. YoProMama (talk) 01:57, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

Hey, I went out and found two more sources.

Best, PrussianOwl (talk) 18:18, 29 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

March 2020

Someone registered the song with a record company that does business with Google.^[1] Either this is an attempt to generate false content ID claims, or the whole controversy is a fabricated hoax. Either way, the fact that this song is able to be purchased from digital stores is notable.

71.32.168.228 (talk) 20:36, 8 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Either way, the fact that this song is able to be purchased from digital stores is notable.

A (likely false) content ID claim is not an implication that the song is purchasable online. Bad actors jump on stuff like this all the time on YouTube. Additionally, it only indicates that the video was removed, not necessarily due to a claim. -- 0x004d (talk) 02:53, 14 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SgvXIirw3I

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:

TMS sample.ogg

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 05:23, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Why do we include Reddit users as reliable sources...?

-- ApChrKey ^Talk 18:12, 29 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ApChrKey because reddit users made the thing and are praising themselves you ignorant fool 2A02:3032:400:B0F2:1934:3034:8C1D:E19 (talk) 15:30, 4 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Because this is about an Internet song. We're not citing some random Reddit user in a highly scientific biology article. Hipotecas (talk) 03:26, 27 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe something can be found here

Archive with old radio broadcasts https://www.rias1.de/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:8109:B40:7ABC:E45E:1051:3907:F836 (talk) 14:27, 9 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This could be a lifetime of a task. But it might be a good lead, as has it has tons of old recordings, also from GDR, which some people assume as the origin of the song and why no trace to it can be found. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:638:806:68:25B2:43DB:BC44:22AB (talk) 08:06, 17 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Solving the problem?

An approach can be found here.--Landmensch 2 (talk) 02:23, 9 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Topic provided by Youtube

apparently, "Too Lost LLC" is providing a playlist of songs by an unknown band "Like the Wind" album "Statues in Motion" since Feb 25th 2022. so who is "Too Lost LLC" and why do they claim ?copyright? on these songs. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGDUqXQIZo1-ZGULvb3pFmQ/about luckily there havent been any copyright claims on youtube yet, they must not have legal grounds to attempt content-id. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.171.34.187 (talk) 03:43, 27 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

now a 3rd party is claiming copyright content on youtube

La Canción Más Misteriosa De Internet
Desconocido

Video cannot be monetized Copyright owner's policy Monetized in some territories

Copyright owners
TuneCore
On behalf of: The Most Mysterious Song On The Internet

How Do We Know the Song Is in Fact from the 80s?

I really think that the statement "The song was recorded from a Norddeutscher Rundfunk (NDR) broadcast at an unknown date, widely speculated to be 1983 or 1984" needs some sort of qualification. How do we know that statement is factual? As far as I've been able to see, there's no conclusive evidence to validate the song's age; all anyone has (as far as I know) is the word of Darius S, whoever that might be (his "sister" might be a sock puppet), and a digital copy of the song from YouTube. Maybe something like "According to internet user Darius S, the song was recorded..."? Mpaniello (talk) 17:05, 29 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Fair point that the statement isn't entirely clear. I edited the wording and added a reference to the Rolling Stone article, where the original poster says it was likely recorded no earlier than 1984. ForsythiaJo (talk) 01:01, 30 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you very much! Mpaniello (talk) 01:06, 30 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

My house reference

I feel that this article should include the use of the song in the MyHouse doom mod. I do not know how to format an addition to the article. Insecurestud (talk) 20:45, 14 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have no qualms about adding this to the article, as long as we can cite a reliable source (see WP:RS) for the info. ForsythiaJo (talk) 23:31, 14 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Statues in Motion & Alvin Dean

Can I add the discussion around SiM and Alvin Dean since they come up a lot in the search.

From the German article:

According to Billy Knight (real name: Vasilis Paleokostas)[24], Like the Wind is a song recorded in 1982 by the Greek new wave/synth-pop band Statues in Motion,[25] which did not make it onto the 1983 album release of the same name[26] due to lack of space. [27] The song was sung by Alvin Dean[28] (real name: Giorgios/George Dalambira[29]), through whose stay in Berlin after the band split up the song may have found its way into the German radio programme.[30] Among other things the discrepancy between the Yamaha DX-7 synthesiser (available only from 1983), which was very probably used in the song according to a broad consensus and with which some synthesiser passages of the song could only be realised in the first place, and Billy Knight's statement that he recorded the song with a Yamaha CS-15D, whose technical capabilities would not have been sufficient in the opinion of the critics,[31] as well as further contradictions in Billy Knight's statements[32] speak against the authorship of Statues in Motion, in which Ilias Mitsakis (alias Elli Kane) was also involved as lyricist and manager. [24] LordElend (talk) 23:13, 28 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

FEX - Subways of Your Mind is unconfirmed - 04/11/2024

With the solve post, people have begun editing this page without it truly being confirmed yet. This is a normal process for Lostwave and shouldn't be excused for a TMMS either. Reverting the changes until its confirmed. South pole ball (talk) 16:08, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, there are no secondary sources confirming it as yet. We can't use a forum post as a primary reference. G-13114 (talk) 17:57, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Even disregarding secondary sources, the only primary source is still contested. The history of this song has been the target of many hoaxes, until more primary sources are shown the solve is still considered unconfirmed by many regarded researchers. South pole ball (talk) 18:23, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed that any new additions (for the moment) should clearly state that this is a claim being made and not a confirmed fact. Ideally I'd like to see a reliable source say that they've talked to the band directly and confirmed there is material proof. ForsythiaJo (talk) 18:22, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

On this topic, source 15 is a dubious source at best. Even its footnotes state it might not be true, whilst the rest of the source is a rip of the new audio file.

https://www.tsugi.fr/la-chanson-plus-mysterieuse-dinternet-a-ete-trouvee/ South pole ball (talk) 18:33, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, the source is more reporting on the post than the veracity of the discovery. That said, if the website itself is reliable then we could use to source that this is a claim being made, even if we can't use it to cite that this is true.

I don't have strong opinions either way whether we choose to leave the claim or take it out entirely for the time being. ForsythiaJo (talk) 18:36, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've just requested page protection, which might help with the number of edits we're seeing. ForsythiaJo (talk) 18:26, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've also added some invisible text notes to discourage people from editing the Infobox or lead in light of the Reddit post. ForsythiaJo (talk) 18:41, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'd say it's pretty much confirmed, we HAVE the finished song, we HAVE a PHYSICAL COPY of the song Flixxy0 (talk) 18:58, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We do not have a physical copy, we have a new audio file from FEX, the supposed artists. But as any time in the Lostwave community would show, that means nothing. People can easily recreate songs now that appear almost exact like the originals.

The only other evidence we have is that this FEX band is real (from the 1980s news clippings) yet that does not prove they had made the song.

Patience is the key, other similar songs like 'Edge of a Dream' or 'Treadmill of Time' spent years waiting for confirmation. TMMS is the most sought after lost song, we should treat it with the respect it deserves. South pole ball (talk) 19:08, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, there's no need to rush, wikipedia is rightly cautious, and should set a high bar of confirmation before we can definitively say that the mystery has been solved. After all, if this turns out to be another hoax then caution will have been vindicated. If it is legit, then there's no harm in waiting a bit. G-13114 (talk) 19:24, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Except we do have a physical copy of the song, https://i.redd.it/x6lslr53jvyd1.jpg?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

There's also evidence of FEX being an Flixxy0 (talk) 19:32, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That is a photo of a cassette, this again proves nothing. I could purchase a cassette and print a photo onto for pennies. All evidence so far provided does not remove their burden of proof, no official documentation that had existed during the recording of TMMS has been shown.

We have a GEMA archive which had been registered in the last 2 weeks, as confirmed by the primary source. Which would have been the only evidence we have seen so far.

Although the vocal tracks are very similar, we live in the world of AI now. It is not something that can not be falsified. Please have patience. South pole ball (talk) 19:39, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's not AI, there are MULTIPLE signs something is AI, this has none of them.

Also you keep saying we need a secondary source, where are we going to get a secondary source from? If we go by your insistence we need a secondary source, then that means so many found lostwave songs aren't actually verifiably found because there isn't a "secondary source".

In the meantime the general consensus is that it was found, and I believe it should be marked as such Flixxy0 (talk) 19:47, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We can't use Reddit as a principle source because it's user generated content. We need to wait until some reputable news website or magazine etc picks up the story and verifies it. G-13114 (talk) 19:59, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

404Media has an article out that was published literally 10 minutes ago, do we consider that reputable? If not, what's the criteria?

https://www.404media.co/the-most-mysterious-song-on-the-internet-has-finally-been-identified/ CyberAlexMM (talk) 21:18, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

They're the guys who used to write for Vice Motherboard 2604:2D80:D105:A900:AF15:E006:AA76:DAF2 (talk) 21:24, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Quote from 404Media: "It seems as if the mystery is solved, but the community is still double checking marjin1412’s work. The Mysterious Song Discord server is in read-only mode while the mods wait for more information". So we can use this article to cite the claim, but again the article itself is not confirming the creators/name of the song. ForsythiaJo (talk) 23:15, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Then I have a feeling we're not gonna get a definitive article for a while. Major news publications would not cover this normally, let alone on Election Day. CyberAlexMM (talk) 00:34, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

General consensus can easily be wrong and has happened many times before. EKT had the same treatment on the wikipage even after I had solved it, as all that existed was my post.

The primary source is still contested. South pole ball (talk) 20:01, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Why the uncertainty?

Why are we putting Subways of Your Mind in "theories" and not changing the article name to match? This *is* the name of the song. FEX *is* the band behind the song. There's no ifs ands or buts - the song has been found. CyberAlexMM (talk) 21:13, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Because we don't yet have any reliable sources confirming that it is. If and when we do we can change it. G-13114 (talk) 21:19, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

https://zeitungskiosk.nwzonline.de/titles/nwz/8389/publications/68055/pages/29 Day0han (talk) 23:57, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SgvXIirw3I

[1]