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'{{Skip to talk}} {{Talk header|search=y|archive_age=90|archive_bot=lowercase sigmabot III}} {{Article history |action1=FAC |action1date=20:16, 22 October 2006 (UTC) |action1link=Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Elvis Presley/archive1 |action1result=failed |action1oldid=83063082 |action2=GAN |action2date=00:41, 7 July 2007 (UTC) |action2link=Talk:Elvis Presley/archive19#Good article nomination on hold |action2result=listed |action2oldid=146894542 |action3=FAC |action3date=22:56, 24 September 2007 (UTC) |action3link=Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Elvis Presley/archive2 |action3result=failed |action3oldid=160029510 |action4=GAR |action4date=03:09, 25 November 2007 (UTC) |action4link=Talk:Elvis Presley/archive22#Delisted GA |action4result=delisted |action4oldid=173645743 |action5=FAC |action5date=19:38, 30 January 2010 (UTC) |action5link=Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Elvis Presley/archive3 |action5result=failed |action5oldid=340894651 |action6=FAC |action6date=18:44, 23 February 2010 (UTC) |action6link=Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Elvis Presley/archive4 |action6result=promoted |action6oldid=345852096 |topic=music |currentstatus=FA|maindate=January 8, 2012 |action7 = FAR |action7date = 2018-10-25 |action7link = Wikipedia:Featured article review/Elvis Presley/archive1 |action7result = kept |action7oldid = 865246893 |otd1date=2004-04-21|otd1oldid=6718180 |otd2date=2005-02-22|otd2oldid=13972237 |otd3date=2007-08-16|otd3oldid=151704700 |otd4date=2008-08-16|otd4oldid=231847197 |otd5date=2009-08-16|otd5oldid=308242610 |otd6date=2010-08-16|otd6oldid=379292203 |otd7date=2010-12-21|otd7oldid=403555255 |otd8date=2013-08-16|otd8oldid=568674590 |otd9date=2016-08-16|otd9oldid=734569383 |otd10date=2017-08-16|otd10oldid=795798681 |otd11date=2020-08-16|otd11oldid=972948771 }} {{User:MiszaBot/config | archiveheader = {{tan}} | maxarchivesize = 150K | counter = 34 | archive = Talk:Elvis Presley/Archive %(counter)d | algo = old(90d) |minthreadstoarchive = 1 |minthreadsleft = 3 }} {{User:HBC Archive Indexerbot/OptIn |target= Talk:Elvis Presley/Archive index |mask= Talk:Elvis Presley/Archive <#> |leading_zeros=0 |indexhere=yes |template= }} {{American English}} {{All time pageviews|74}} {{Annual report|[[Wikipedia:2022 Top 50 Report|2022]]|16,675,885}} {{Top 25 Report|Jan 4 2015|Aug 13 2017|Jun 19 2022|until|Jul 17 2022|Aug 7 2022|until|Aug 28 2022|Jan 8 2023}} {{Vital article|topic=People|level=4|link=Wikipedia:Vital articles/Level/4/People|anchor=Rock (18 articles)|class=FA}} {{WikiProjectBannerShell|collapsed=yes|1= {{WikiProject Biography |living=no |class=FA |musician-work-group=yes |musician-priority=top |filmbio-work-group=yes |filmbio-priority=high |core=yes |listas=Presley, Elvis }} {{WikiProject Elvis Presley nigger|class=FA|importance=top|listas=Presley, Elvis}} {{WikiProject Nevada|class=FA|listas=Presley, Elvis|b1=yes|b2=yes|b3=yes|b4=yes|b5=yes|b6=yes|importance=mid|Las Vegas=yes|Las Vegas-importance=High}} {{WikiProject Pop music|class=FA|importance=top}} {{WikiProject Rock music|class=FA|importance=top|listas=Presley, Elvis}} {{WikiProject Tennessee|class=FA|importance=high|listas=Presley, Elvis}} {{WikiProject United States|class=FA|importance=top|MS=yes|MS-importance=top|USMusic=yes|USMusic-importance=top|portal1-name=United States|portal1-link=Selected culture biography/9}} {{WikiProject Westerns|class=FA|importance=mid}} {{WP1.0|v0.5=pass|class=FA|category=Arts|VA=yes}} }} {{tmbox|type=style|text=[[Elvis Presley#Questions over cause of death|''Questions over cause of death'']] gives the balanced views of various experts. Please note that although Nichopoulos, Presley's main physician, was at the time ''"exonerated of criminal liability for the singer's death, ... His license was suspended for three months. It was permanently revoked in the 1990s after the Tennessee Medical Board brought new charges of over-prescription."'' Consensus among regular editors who judge it important to preserve a reliable, mainstream view in this encyclopedia article is that the discredited doctor's opinions, such as those published in his 2010 book, and including his attempt to emphasize constipation as the likely cause of death, should not be propagated by Wikipedia, and hence receive no coverage in this article.}} {{annual readership}} <!--- Please place dashboard templates ---><br> <!--- Between these lines ---> == Request for a photo from later years == The article contains a lot of pictures, but none of them show Presley in his later years (after 1972). We are told that he gained a lot of weight and his health dramatically deteriorated after 1973 and especially by early 1977, but we are not shown his appearance. The commons category "Category:Elvis Presley by year" ends in 1973. I'm sure there must be a lot of pictures of him from 1975–1977 somewhere{{snd}} he was a very famous, frequently photographed person and he continued to appear in public. It would be nice to have such a picture in the article. —⁠ ⁠[[User:BarrelProof|BarrelProof]] ([[User talk:BarrelProof|talk]]) 21:45, 3 June 2023 (UTC) I suggest illustrating the “1973-1977: Health deteriorations and death” with [[:File:Elvis Presley 1973 RCA Records and Tapes publicity 2 - cropped.png|this image]] [[Special:Contributions/83.52.72.57|83.52.72.57]] ([[User talk:83.52.72.57|talk]]) 07:09, 29 June 2023 (UTC) :Sorry, I posted it in this topic when it should be in its own one [[Special:Contributions/83.52.72.57|83.52.72.57]] ([[User talk:83.52.72.57|talk]]) 07:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC) :That photo is from 1973, the very beginning of that period, and is apparently a publicity photo. I think it would be better to have a photo from 1976 or 1977 taken by someone who is not trying to be especially flattering. —⁠ ⁠[[User:BarrelProof|BarrelProof]] ([[User talk:BarrelProof|talk]]) 16:25, 3 August 2023 (UTC) == Semi-protected edit request on 28 June 2023 == {{edit semi-protected|Elvis Presley|answered=yes}} Please add in his identical twin brother, Jesse Garon Presley. He died at birth, and I think that t would be a good addition to this page. There is already a page for Jesse. [[User:12345678910111213141516171819abc|12345678910111213141516171819abc]] ([[User talk:12345678910111213141516171819abc|talk]]) 14:12, 28 June 2023 (UTC) :Not done; Jesse Garon is already mentioned in the article. [[User:Jpgordon|--jpgordon]]^{<small>[[User talk:Jpgordon|&#x1d122;&#x1d106;&#x1D110;&#x1d107;]]</small>} 14:16, 28 June 2023 (UTC) == elvis has the most popular us stamp in history == https://postalmuseum.si.edu/exhibition/art-of-the-stamp-the-artwork-stamps-with-a-story/the-elvis-stamp-america-elects-a-king#:~:text=A%20decade%20later%2C%20the%20Elvis,commemorative%20stamp%20of%20all%20time. please add that to his list of achievements [[Special:Contributions/50.77.26.133|50.77.26.133]] ([[User talk:50.77.26.133|talk]]) 17:49, 8 July 2023 (UTC) ==Length== At over 19k words of readable prose, this article is quite long and detailed. It would benefit from having some extraneous details removed (for example, Alene) and from being generally condensed throughout. [[User:Nikkimaria|Nikkimaria]] ([[User talk:Nikkimaria|talk]]) 23:56, 2 August 2023 (UTC) :As another example, the "Childhood in Tupelo" section is detailed to the point of parody. '''<span style="font-family:Lucida;">[[User:Aza24|<span style="color:darkred">Aza24</span>]][[User talk:Aza24|<span style="color:#848484"> (talk)</span>]]</span>''' 23:27, 9 August 2023 (UTC) ::The article has had a "too long" tag since June 2023. It has [[WP:SIZERULE]] problems, with more than 15,000 words and 100 kB it should be considered for trimming or splitting into different articles.--'''''[[User:ianmacm|<span style="background:#88b;color:#cff;font-variant:small-caps">♦Ian<span style="background:#99c">Ma<span style="background:#aad">c</span></span>M♦</span>]] ^{[[User_talk:ianmacm|(talk to me)]]}''''' 07:27, 10 August 2023 (UTC) :::I attempted to trim and it is now at 17.1k words. :::We need to move the whole [[Elvis_Presley#Artistry]] to [[Cultural impact of Elvis Presley]]. That will reduce 2,000 words. [[User:Editorkamran|Editorkamran]] ([[User talk:Editorkamran|talk]]) 20:52, 16 August 2023 (UTC) * [[User:Editorkamran|Editorkamran]] I think the "Equestrian" section should be moved to the [[Graceland]] article. I don't see how this is related to his public image. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB|2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB]] ([[User talk:2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB|talk]]) 16:50, 27 August 2023 (UTC) *:@[[User:Nikkimaria|Nikkimaria]] In regard to your revert of my tag removal, I did actually look at the talk page. Seeing that the issue has been resolved (at least partially) and knowing that this is a featured article, I decided to remove the tag. I don't see how having an FA tagged like this brings any benefit to the casual reader who would be looking for an encyclopedic and highest quality article (based on our content assessment criteria). If we cannot fix, then I do believe it should be reassessed. Your curt revert a bit like you're pulling rank based on tenure, but I won't push any more. [[User:Ppt91|<span style="background-color:white"><span style="font-family:Rockwell;font-weight:bold;color:DimGray;">Ppt91</span></span>]][[User talk:Ppt91|<span style="background-color:White"><span style="color:DimGray;">^talk</span></span>]] 14:42, 30 August 2023 (UTC) :::{{u|Nikkimaria}} has tagged many major pages with the tag and always reverts the logical removal of the tag. Please understand what exemptions are, [[WP:COMMONSENSE]], or that these pages, many of them features, are fine as is. This seems a problem which editors have tried to address. As for this page, please editors, don't cut or destroy a feature page just because one editor seems to be on a good faith but misguided length-crusade. Thanks. [[User:Randy Kryn|Randy Kryn]] ([[User talk:Randy Kryn|talk]]) 15:02, 30 August 2023 (UTC) ::::[[WP:LENGTH]] is a guideline, not a policy. {{u|Nikkimaria}}, please try to memorize the instructions for all guidelines which include the wording "...though it is best treated with common sense, and occasional exceptions may apply." [[User:Randy Kryn|Randy Kryn]] ([[User talk:Randy Kryn|talk]]) 15:06, 30 August 2023 (UTC) :::::I'm aware of that, thanks. It is common sense that it is even more important for a relatively high-profile article to be accessible. It is common sense that a featured article, which is meant to be an example of our best work and of "highest quality", should actually ''be'' that, and should follow the FA criteria; removing tags hides rather than addresses concerns. It is the ''opposite'' of common sense to argue that ''because'' an article is featured, it should not be tagged. Removing tags before the issues they identify are fully addressed make it less likely, not more, that they ever will be - that certainly neither benefits the reader nor supports the article remaining an FA. [[User:Nikkimaria|Nikkimaria]] ([[User talk:Nikkimaria|talk]]) 01:13, 31 August 2023 (UTC) ::::::When needs to be addressed? The suggestions above seem to be just looking for things to cut because of the tag. For instance, the criticized early section is only five paragraphs long, covering the crucial first 13 years of Presley's life. And there certainly is no need to move any of, let alone the entire, 'Artistry' section. Putting a toolong tag up creates an excuse to remove such information under the guise of "length". There is no policy about length, [[WP:COMMONSENSE]] covers keeping the page as intact as possible. [[User:Randy Kryn|Randy Kryn]] ([[User talk:Randy Kryn|talk]]) 01:45, 31 August 2023 (UTC) :::::::A too-long tag encourages editors to improve the concision of the article, making it more accessible to readers and in accordance with multiple guidelines as well as the FA criteria which it is expected to follow. Nothing about "as intact as possible" is a common-sense argument with regards to length, or with basis in any policy or guideline - it's only an argument for the status quo with zero consideration for whether the status quo is or is not the optimal approach. You could apply the same argument to an article five times as long, and it would be equally meaningless. [[User:Nikkimaria|Nikkimaria]] ([[User talk:Nikkimaria|talk]]) 02:01, 31 August 2023 (UTC) == The "death" and "cause of death" sections need some additions == Some of [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Elvis_Presley&diff=prev&oldid=1172082120 my additions] have recently been removed. I think this is not O.K. These different opinions are currently cited in the "cause of death" section of the article: :- Dr Jerry Francisco says that the immediate cause of death was cardiac arrest and drugs played no role in Presley's death. :- Biographer Peter Guralnick writes that drug use was heavily implicated in Presley's death. :- Forensic pathologist Cyril Wecht concludes that a combination of depressants had resulted in Presley's accidental death. :- Pathologist Michael Baden suggests that an enlarged heart, together with his drug habit, caused his death. :- Coroner Joseph Davis says that there is nothing that supports a death from drugs and everything points to a sudden, violent heart attack. :- According to biographer Joel Williamson, meticulous dissection of the body confirmed that Elvis was chronically ill with diabetes, glaucoma, and constipation, so that the doctors saw evidence that his body had been wracked over a span of years by a large and constant stream of drugs. The following addition is necessary: :According to biographer Frank Coffey and Dan Warlick, one of the physicians who were present at the autopsy, Presley's death was due to "a phenomenon called the [[Valsalva maneuver]]," i.e. "essentially straining on the toilet leading to heart stoppage—plausible because Elvis suffered constipation, a common reaction to drug use"<ref>Frank Coffey, ''The Complete Idiot's Guide to Elvis'' (1997), p. 247.</ref> and "high-fat, high-cholesterol gorging … Put simply, the strain of attempting to defecate compressed the singer's [[abdominal aorta]], shutting down his heart."<ref>Neil Wertheimer, ''Total Health for Men'' (Rodale Press, 1997), p. 132.</ref> This addition reflects a view that has not been previously expressed in the article. It supports the opinion that both drug use and a violent heart attack caused Presley's sudden death. Drug use had caused constipation and when Elvis was sitting on the toilet the Valsalva maneuver had led to heart stoppage. According to Dr Dan Warlick, who was present at the autopsy, this is the best explanation of what happened. Dylan Jones emphasises that Elvis was sitting on the toilet when he died: "His light blue pyjamas were around his ankles."<ref>Dylan Jones, ''Elvis Has Left the Building: The Day the King Died'' (New York and London, 2014), chapter 2: The Day Elvis Died.</ref> In similar terms, Peter Guralnick writes that "Warlick found a stain on the bathroom carpeting … that seemed to indicate where Elvis had thrown up after being stricken, apparently while seated on the toilet" and that Presley's "large intestine was clogged with fecal matter, indicating a painful and longstanding bowel condition. The bowel condition alone would have strongly suggested … that drug use was heavily implicated in this unanticipated death of a middle-aged man with no known history of heart disease … It was certainly possible that he had been taken while 'straining at stool' …" <ref>Peter Guralnick, ''Careless Love: The Unmaking of Elvis Presley'' (1999), pp. 651-652</ref> Consequently, the "death" section needs the following addition: :Biographer Joel Williamson suggests that "involving a reaction to the [[codeine]]" he had taken "and attempts to move his bowels—he experienced pain and fright while sitting on the toilet. Alarmed, he stood up ... and fell face down in the fetal position." Drooling on the rug and "unable to breathe, he died."<ref>Joel Williamson, ''Elvis Presley: A Southern Life'' (Oxford University Press, 2014), p. 18.</ref> In its present state, the article only says that Elvis's fiancée Ginger Alden discovered him in an unresponsive state on the bathroom floor of his Graceland mansion and that attempts to revive him failed. A short explanation of what may have caused his death, according to the mainstream biographers, is missing. [[User:ADogCalledElvis|ADogCalledElvis]] ([[User talk:ADogCalledElvis|talk]]) 00:22, 27 August 2023 (UTC) * The addition should be more concise. I propose this, "According to biographer Frank Coffey and Dan Warlick, one of the physicians who were present at the autopsy, Presley's death was due to [[Valsalva maneuver]]." The readers can click on the inner link if they want to know what Valsalva maneuver is. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB|2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB]] ([[User talk:2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB|talk]]) 16:56, 27 August 2023 (UTC) ::According to Barry B. White, the main causes of [[Valsalva maneuver]] are: 1. Straining at stool due to constipation. 2. Straining to urinate. 3. Straining to raise up in bed or to get in or out of bed.<ref>Barry B. White, ''Therapy in Acute Coronary Care'' (1971), p. 65.</ref> However, it does not necessarily lead to death. It is necessary to mention in the Presley article why a specific form of Valsalva maneuver, according to Dr Warlick, was responsible for Elvis's death. It occurred during straining to pass a hardened stool: "If defecation is suppressed over long periods, problems can occur, such as constipation or stool impaction. Defecation can be facilitated by the Valsalva maneuver. This maneuver involves contraction of the chest muscles on a closed glottis with simultaneous contraction of the abdominal muscles."<ref>Sharon Mantik Lewis, Margaret McLean Heitkemper, Shannon Ruff Dirksen (eds.), ''Medical-Surgical Nursing: Assessment and Management of Clinical Problems'', 6th edition, vol. 2 (2004), p. 951.</ref> Physicians point out "that the danger of a Valsalva maneuver is increased by constipation,"<ref>Gladys Nite and Frank Neal Willis, ''The Coronary Patient: Hospital Care and Rehabilitation'' (1964), p. 164.</ref>, as in the case of Presley. According to Dr Warlick (who examined Elvis's body at autopsy), Presley died from a Valsalva maneuver that "caused the heart to stop when the body strained. When the body senses a vascular occlusion or blocked major artery—the heart is signalled to stop creating the pressure in the vessel. When Elvis compressed his abdominal aorta by straining, his heart, in response, went into arrhythmia and quit working suddenly. All of the information from the scene investigation is completely consistent with this theory," said Warlick. [[User:ADogCalledElvis|ADogCalledElvis]] ([[User talk:ADogCalledElvis|talk]]) 13:20, 28 August 2023 (UTC) :::[[User:ADogCalledElvis]] This is too wordy as conciseness is often better. As a reader, I don't care about all of the technical details. If a reader really wants to find out all of the details, they can find those sources and read them themselves. :::My second proposal, "According to biographer Frank Coffey and Dan Warlick, one of the physicians who were present at the autopsy, Presley's death was caused by [[Valsalva maneuver]] due to constipation as a result of drug abuse." [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C44:117F:95BE:3CA7:A195:B058:E19A|2600:6C44:117F:95BE:3CA7:A195:B058:E19A]] ([[User talk:2600:6C44:117F:95BE:3CA7:A195:B058:E19A|talk]]) 20:58, 28 August 2023 (UTC) ::::An additional sentence provides the necessary clarity: :::::According to biographer Frank Coffey and Dan Warlick, one of the physicians who were present at the autopsy, Presley's death was caused by a [[Valsalva maneuver]] due to constipation as a result of drug abuse.<ref>Frank Coffey, ''The Complete Idiot's Guide to Elvis'' (1997), p. 247.</ref> When using the toilet, "the strain of attempting to defecate compressed the singer's [[abdominal aorta]], shutting down his heart."<ref>Neil Wertheimer, ''Total Health for Men'' (Rodale Press, 1997), p. 132.</ref> ::::Now all readers are fully informed. [[User:ADogCalledElvis|ADogCalledElvis]] ([[User talk:ADogCalledElvis|talk]]) 19:35, 29 August 2023 (UTC) :::::I like this compromise. The debate has been fruitful. It has been a pleasure to debate with you. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C44:117F:95BE:D973:95C0:1776:4340|2600:6C44:117F:95BE:D973:95C0:1776:4340]] ([[User talk:2600:6C44:117F:95BE:D973:95C0:1776:4340|talk]]) 20:02, 29 August 2023 (UTC) {{Talk reflist}} == Semi-protected edit request on 27 August 2023 == {{edit semi-protected|Elvis Presley|answered=yes}} "The horse named Palomino Rising Sun was Presley' favorite horse, and there are many photographs of him riding him" -> this lone sentence should be attached to the paragraph above it for aesthetic reason. It doesn't look good when a paragraph only has 1 sentence. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C44:117F:95BE:75B7:3532:D2D:152B|2600:6C44:117F:95BE:75B7:3532:D2D:152B]] ([[User talk:2600:6C44:117F:95BE:75B7:3532:D2D:152B|talk]]) 03:44, 27 August 2023 (UTC) :{{done}}<!-- Template:ESp --> '''<span style="color:#f535aa">—</span> [[User:Paper9oll|<span style="background:#f535aa;color:#fff;padding:2px;border-radius:5px">Paper9oll</span>]] <span style="color:#f535aa">([[User talk:Paper9oll|🔔]] • [[Special:Contributions/Paper9oll|📝]])</span>''' 05:57, 27 August 2023 (UTC) == Semi-protected edit request on 27 August 2023 (2) == {{Edit semi-protected|Elvis Presley|answered=yes}} "She is one of three of the original staff members still working at the estate" -> "She is one of '''the three''' original staff members still working at the estate." This is redundant and simply just bad writing. "there are many photographs of him riding him" -> "there are many photographs of '''Presley''' riding him." "Him riding him" is just bad writing. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB|2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB]] ([[User talk:2600:6C44:117F:95BE:F938:1751:BD57:70EB|talk]]) 17:16, 27 August 2023 (UTC) :{{done}}<!-- Template:ESp --> and consider creating an account, so you can become autoconfirmed yourself and make such edits without the need to use the request system [[User talk:Casualdejekyll|<span style="color:#E6007A">casualdejekyll</span>]] 17:54, 27 August 2023 (UTC)'