Wikisource:Scriptorium/Help

How do we add works without usable scans?

Atlas Games has released a number of Ars Magica books under the CC-BY-SA 4.0. However, as they put it "The Licensed Material is the TEXT of the game books. It does not include the the trade dress, artwork, cartography, or logos." So we can not just upload the PDFs of the books. What's the best way to handle this? Prosfilaes (talk) 07:51, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

I'd say just leave it. There are plenty of awesome and useful texts published and actually free that we can work on instead of wasting time on texts where the publisher is deliberately making it difficult to reuse it (undermining the seemingly open license). There's no even half-way good way for us to host this text unless and until someone else we recognise as a reputable publisher republishes the text in a form that is actually free. Any hoop-jumping we do before that happens is just going to water down our commitment to verifiability and openness, and create maintenance problems for ourselves down the road. Xover (talk) 08:09, 5 January 2025 (UTC)

We could just upload scans of the work, and slap a "copyrighted text" thing on any image in the book. Probably just a hassle, but at least we have another (technically-)free work in the database. CitationsFreak (talk) 00:18, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• Prosfilaes: The way to go about it would be to take the PDF and manually hide every image. Is there even a PDF available? I only see print copies available for sale. There appear to be illustrated borders on every page, requiring manual editing of each page. You could, of course, simply add the text without uploading a PDF; that is a common practice here, as I’m sure you know. TE(æ)A,ea. (talk) 01:18, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

They're available on line, and I bought most of them in a Bundle of Holding a few years back. It's probably not something I'm going to end up doing, given the difficulty and trademark limitations. I do think Xover is a bit unfair; the goal was to permit people to make books in the setting, and, in their words:

There's also a whole argument about copyright and RPG rules, and one point of this license is to just sidestep it. Go ahead and make a techniques/forms based magic system RPG of furry space wizards. We were not ever going to sue you, but now you can be sure that no future owners of the game could either.

The release was more of a simple way of doing that, rather than the publisher deliberately making it difficult to reuse.--Prosfilaes (talk) 00:02, 30 January 2025 (UTC)

In Obitum M S, X° Maij, 1614

For some reason, this is categorized as a 1660 work. It should properly have no date, as a versions page, but 1660 is definitely wrong. TE(æ)A,ea. (talk) 00:10, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

Why should a version page have no date? All works have an original date of either composition or publication. --EncycloPetey (talk) 00:36, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

In this case, the date is supplied by Wikidata. I have corrected the date. --EncycloPetey (talk) 00:37, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

• EncycloPetey: The date refers to the date of publication (for copyright purposes, if for no other reason). While individual versions will have individual publication dates, the work as an abstract concept does not have a date; the only thing being shown on the page is Wikisource’s own list of versions. I respond now because I found another example: most of Shakespeare’s sonnets, from Sonnet 6 (Shakespeare) on, are given as 1840 works. TE(æ)A,ea. (talk) 02:00, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

  The date on an edition refers to the date of that version's publication, yes. But the date on the work (which we treat as a version page) refers to the initial date at which the work came into existence. This is date of first publication for most modern works, but may refer to date of composition or date of first performance for classical works. Even the abstraction of the work has a date from which it's existence can be recorded, and that's what Wikidata and Wikipedia use as well. --EncycloPetey (talk) 02:05, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

  • That makes sense for Wikipedia, perhaps, but not for us. The <Year> works categories should only include works, but versions pages are not actually works; they are merely (Wikisource-curated) lists of (public-domain) editions of works. The lists themselves have no inherent date, and thus versions pages should not be put in <Year> works categories. Besides, while for actual editions the year can be compared with the text and corrected quite easily, it seems that all of these issues stem from the always less-than-accurate Wikidata being used to populate local templates. I have only found them by searching through the <Year> works categories (although usually I’m in the 1600s). TE(æ)A,ea. (talk) 13:53, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

    If a date on Wikipedia is incorrect, then Wikidata can be edited. We're not putting in a date derived from the lists of editions, but are using the same date that "makes sense" for Wikidata and Wikipedia. As you have noted, the concept of that date does carry usable meaning, as it makes sense in its use on both Wikipedia and on Wikidata. Such a date does not cease to have meaning simply because it is being used on another project. It is the same date fpr the same sense. It also sounds as though you are using a different meaning of the term works than is used on Wikidata and FRBR, where the works pages are tied to the WP articles and our "Versions" pages; perhaps this is part of the confusion. Italian Wikisource has solved the problem by using an "Opera:" (Work:) namespace to use in lieu of "Versions" pages, to make it clear that such lists of editions of the same work are functionally the same as indicating a conceptual work, merely listing the various editions in which that work has been issued.

    If your argument is that our Versions pages are not themselves works, that much is correct. But neither are the Wikipedia articles those works, and neither is the Wikidata item associated with that article the work. Whether it's a Wikipedia article written about the work, or a Wikisource versions page listing editions of the work, or a Wikiquote page with quotations from editions of the work, none of those are the work. But they are all embodiments of what that project carries in association with the abstract concept of the work. Wikipedia will have article written about the work. Wikiquote collects quotations from various editions of the work. And Wikisource proofreads editions of the work. And on Wikidata, each of those different sorts of embodiments are collected together on the data item assigned to carry the data and database identifiers for that work. --EncycloPetey (talk) 14:53, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

Upload DJVUs for me?

Looking to add some specific works, can someone upload the following DJVUs and insert them into a page with the appropriate title so that I can go about proofreading?

The Smiling Isle of Passamaquoddy - https://ia801204.us.archive.org/16/items/smilingisleofpas00thom/smilingisleofpas00thom.pdf

https://archive.org/stream/collectionsofnew41012newb/collectionsofnew41012newb_djvu.txt

https://dn790006.ca.archive.org/0/items/exodusofloyalist00sieb/exodusofloyalist00sieb.pdf

https://ia600200.us.archive.org/28/items/historyofislands00lori/historyofislands00lori.pdf

Much thanks. Fundy Isles Historian - J (talk) 01:03, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

It's much more helpful if you link to the work page on the Internet Archive, not directly to the PDF. You can always upload them to Commons with https://ia-upload.wmcloud.org/ .--Prosfilaes (talk) 04:40, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

It won't allow me to upload PDFs to Commons saying it's abusive for new users, and I can't tell what I'm doing (wrong) with Index:Myths and Legends.djvu for example.

• Fundy Isles Historian - J: You didn’t do anything wrong; Commons often doesn’t display DJVU and PDF files appropriately on initial upload. I purged the cache on Commons, and now the DJVU seems to be working. Do you just want this file, or were you interested in working on others as well? TE(æ)A,ea. (talk) 00:58, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

  Agree with what TE(æ)A,ea said, this is an all-too-frequent problem. The problem persists when using IA Upload as Prosfilaes suggests. After much fiddling with this over the years, I have generally found that purging the cache on the file at Commons is the missing piece. I've always meant to check whether there's an open ticket about this, it seems like something that could be pretty easily solved in software...but I can't really think of the right words to describe it, to search for an existing ticket. TE(æ)A,ea. any thoughts? -Pete (talk) 02:09, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

  It's a long story, and there's a constellation of tasks about it on phab. IIRC it's related to how MW handles caching these files. — Alien  3
  3 3 07:01, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

Well, The Smiling Isle of Passamaquoddy has about all the work I can put into it now I think - it might be ready to go on the front page or something I have no idea. Fundy Isles Historian - J (talk) 21:58, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

It should not be listed on the front page until all pages have been proofread and the missing images inserted. We don't promote incomplete or half-finished works. --EncycloPetey (talk) 22:09, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

How to handle two texts in one?

I've currently finished proofreading this transcription that someone else abandoned. This index contains two texts in one. How would I handle them? Norbillian (talk) 16:22, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

You can add an {{AuxTOC}} and split it into two subpages (like here Anarchy and Is It All a Dream?) Thanks for finishing it! MarkLSteadman (talk) 16:46, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

Thanks! Norbillian (talk) 16:53, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

One possibility is to handle it like Pindar and Anacreon, which is also a publication of two different texts as a single volume. --EncycloPetey (talk) 16:54, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

How to tie together an existing document with a source and index?

Another user has started work on the Geneva Bible (Bible (Geneva)) without a source. I have uploaded a source pdf to the Commmons and created an Index file (Index:1560 Geneva Bible.pdf). How do these get tied together? Thanks Greenshed (talk) 20:30, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

The PDF is not displaying correctly for me. So there may be an issue with the PDF, or it may be one of the many transitory "errors" that occur from using PDF files, in which case it may resolve itself in a few days. Until we know that the PDF is correctly formatted, it's hard to say what step(s) to take next. --EncycloPetey (talk) 20:35, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Thanks but even allowing for that issue to resolve itself, how can I give Bible (Geneva) a source tab on which the pdf should appear? Greenshed (talk) 20:39, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

That isn't possible until we have a functioning PDF / Index setup. The Index must first connect to the PDF contents, then we proofread at least a few pages from the Index, and only then can that connection be made. --EncycloPetey (talk) 20:50, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Thanks again. The pdf appears to be rendering now. I would create a page but even for the simpler pages (i.e. no graphics), I need a heading across the top of the page and then the main body of the page in four columns with the two outer columns for the side notes. I've been looking around in the help but can't find how to do this. Any suggestions? Greenshed (talk) 21:26, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

It is indeed going to be a very complex work to proofread. Not one I would recommend for a first-time editor. All I can suggest is that we usually do not try to replicate columns, and that some of the text appears to be marginal gloss, rather than body text. I've never proofread a work with formatting that complex. --EncycloPetey (talk) 21:29, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

The marginal notes are historically important and are perhaps the main reason why King James I banned its publication (so it would be good to retain them if possible). I could start with only the main text in a single column and look to add the side notes later so long as this approach would not lead to significant difficulties later on. What do you think? Greenshed (talk) 21:41, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Without a lot of careful investigation, I can't be certain of making good recommendations. For example, I'm not sure whether the marginal gloss is more like footnotes, or more like sidenotes, or something else. And without properly understanding how they're structured, I cannot recommend the best approach. Hopefully, someone who has worked on similar formatting in older texts can offer a suggestion. --EncycloPetey (talk) 21:45, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Just to second, and expand a bit on, what EncycloPetey says, this looks to be a very challenging project. Certainly margin notes can be replicated, but it will involve using some Wikisource-specific templates (and perhaps some judgment calls about which is the best of multiple ways of accomplishing a given outcome). If you haven't done much proofreading here, I agree you'd do well to start by finding some other works with margin notes, and see how other editors have approached them, and try to pitch in on those. I'm not sure what prompted EP to note that we don't reproduce columns here, but I wholeheartedly agree with that. It should be possible to preserve verse numbering and margin notes without replicating columns. -Pete (talk) 21:51, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Also worth noting, this PDF appears not to have a complete OCR layer. With such a complex document, it's possible that doesn't matter, as the complex formatting might mean it's impractical to base proofreading off of OCR. But typically, we would want to start with a better PDF (or even better, a DJVU file). Pete (talk) 21:53, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for all the help. archive.org has a DJVU file in xml format (https://archive.org/download/1560-geneva-bible) but that just appears to be a (rather poor) OCR of the text. Books from 1560 are beyond my budget so the pdf may be the best we can do. Greenshed (talk) 22:03, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

The IA Upload tool referenced above can generate a DJVU based on the original scans at Internet Archive. In this case, it may or may not be successful due to the size of the file. I've started a request; in a few hours it may or may not be on Commons. You can look for it at File:1560 Geneva Bible.djvu. Pete (talk) 22:21, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

Best Way to Handle a Magazine Series

I've been working on a six-part series of articles about Brazil in 1863 by Adolphe d'Assier published in in translation in The Knickerbocker. French Wikisource puts these together as one work, "Le Brésil et la Société brésilienne". Here, I've kept them a separate articles within separate issues of The Knickerbocker, but I wasn't sure if that's the best (or only) way to handle it. Would creating Brazil and Brazilian Society as single work make sense? It could have an AuxTOC pointing to the six Knickerbocker articles as they have been transcluded, or it could transclude things as a single work with three sections and 11 chapters, like this. The former reflects how it was published; the later would consolidate the content on author pages and would allow the content to be better divided based upon the author's structure for the work. Any thoughts? —Tcr25 (talk) 17:41, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

After a discussion, it was added at WS:SG#Serialized works in periodicals that they should be transcluded under the periodical, but that a mainspace page with {{AuxTOC}} pointing to the individual parts can be created. — Alien  3
3 3 20:06, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

Thank you! I missed that in the style guide... —Tcr25 (talk) 20:11, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

Old index due to Commons file rename

Can someone please delete or redirect Index:104-10125-10133 (JFK, November 3 release).pdf to Index:FBI File 104-10125-10133, Martin Luther King Jr., A Current Analysis.pdf? The file on the Commons was renamed. WeatherWriter (talk) 03:19, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

Done —CalendulaAsteraceae (talk • contribs) 08:27, 28 January 2025 (UTC)

How to add Gadget-Easy LST to another wikisource

Hello, we've added Gadget-Easy LST to the Ukrainian Wikisource to help with faster and easier sectioning of newspapers. Administrator created a page with all the code needed ( uk:MediaWiki:Gadget-Easy_LST.js ), and I turned it on for myself, but when I save the page with ## Section name ## it instead turns into numbered list: 1. 1. Section name ## (See this page)

Does this gadget need to be turned on by default for everyone? Or is there some other change that needs to be done, to make it work? Bicolino34 (talk) 15:18, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

The gadget seems to not load at all.

The line in MediaWiki:Gadgets-definition: Easy_LST[ResourceLoader|default]|Easy_LST.js

And the one in uk:MediaWiki:Gadgets-definition: Easy LST|[ResourceLoader]|Gadget-Easy LST.js

The default normally isn't necessary, but there are multiple other differences (|, _ vs spaces, the Gadget prefix). I'd say try replacing the line at ukws with our line, removing the |default if you want to. — Alien  3
3 3 15:52, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

Thank you for help! It now works as expected Bicolino34 (talk) 16:26, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

Index of all script tags for tag lookup / escape characters for asking about tags

1. Is there a page for looking up specific script tags? For example, I encountered the tag (double open brackets)dhr(double close brackets) in a page I’d like to validate. I went to the main Wikitext Help page and did a search for “dhr” (as well as a search for the tag with its opening and closing double brackets) and found 0 results. Is there a central document or location where I can search all tags (both current and deprecated) and get a list of results with links to all styleguide documents containing instructions for usage (or updated alternatives for those deprecated) of that searched tag?
2. Where can I find information on formatting specific to “discussion” or “help” pages, so that I can include a plaintext string of a Wikitext formatting tag without triggering the formatting for that tag — so that I don’t have to describe the tag with euphemisms - e.g. “(open double brackets)tag characters(close double brackets)”?

Thank you for your help and welcoming newbie editors! Grayautumnday (talk) 20:42, 28 January 2025 (UTC)

1. I suppose that by tag you mean {{this}}? They're called templates.

If you want to search for a template, it would be a search string like insource:/\{\{template name here[\|\}]/ (e.g. here insource:/\{\{dhr[\|\}]/.

For documentation, most templates, when you go to their pages, e.g. {{dhr}}, show the documentation from its /doc subpage.

2. There are multiple things:

• To just refer to a template, use {{tl}}, like so: {{tl|name}}, which will give this result: {{name}}.
• To show code, you can either use nowiki tags, like this: <nowiki>code {{goes}} here</nowiki>, or syntaxhighlight, like so: <syntaxhighlight lang="wikitext" inline>code goes here&</syntaxhighlight>.

— Alien  3
3 3 21:03, 28 January 2025 (UTC)

These are templates, so you can do a search for Template:dhr (for example). Help:Templates is the best place to start. In terms of referring to a template use the {{tl}} template that will allow you to refer to a template, e.g. {{dhr}}. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 21:05, 28 January 2025 (UTC)

Page Numbering that Incorporates Chapter

I was proofreading ToCs in Index:United States Army Field Manual 3-13 Information Operations.djvu, and I noticed that the page numbering incorporated the chapter number and page number by placing a hyphen between both numbers (for example, chap. 5, pg. 1 as 5-1, or chap. 2, pg. 19 as 2-19). This made it very inconvenient to add {{scan page link 2}} templates to ToCs, as I had to look over every single page (the numbering system was not incorporated into the <pagelist>). I then decided to go the <pagelist> to add the page numbering into the index page for the purposes of making it easier to navigate and add chapter ToCs in the future.

However, I could not find a solution that would do produce this numbering system in the <pagelist>, without me manual entering "𝑥-𝑦" (𝑥 corresponding to chapter number, 𝑦 corresponding to page number) for every single page. I tried to find a solution myself, looked at Help:Page numbers, and searched the help request archives, all to no avail. Is there any existing way that I could enter a <pagelist> that uses this numbering system? Is there possibly a way using concatenation or some fancy wiki-markup that I do not know about? GrammarPoliceOffical (diſcuſs ſ ſtuff I did ſ my uſer page) 01:45, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

As I see it:

The headers use 2-19, but that page is still page 19. Same as in most works the header will be something like

42

THIS IS A CHAPTER NAME

but it's still page 42. So, just put 42 in the pagelist. — Alien  3
3 3 07:35, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

We can use multiple pagelist commands. See Index:Tracts for the Times Vol 1.djvu for an example of where I used this technique. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 08:20, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

Download not working

Hello. I was trying to download https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Little_Bessie but it does not work. Thanks in advance for fixing. gmt@uniedi.com 82.192.128.110 10:07, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

What error are you meeting, precisely? (if it takes a while, that's pretty normal, it often happens. should be done in a few minutes) — Alien  3
3 3 14:54, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

It took a bit more than five minutes for me. — Alien  3
3 3 15:00, 2 February 2025 (UTC)

How to find works with the largest number of versions?

How do you find them? Is it possible with Wikisource API, PetScan, even SQL dumps, anything? I.e. Alice's Adventures in Wonderland (Rackham) has a note: For other versions of this work, see Alice's Adventures in Wonderland.. It links to Alice's Adventures in Wonderland which doesn't have a Source/Edit buttons, is it an automatic page?

Also, maybe it's possible to find all books where given work is published? I.e. Index page can have Contents linking to works, like this one: Index:Pain--Eliza.djvu. Making it theoretically possible to find all books where given work is published and at what page. And maybe even sort them by date of publication. How to do it? Podbrushkin (talk) 10:48, 5 February 2025 (UTC)

Alice's Adventures in Wonderland is a Versions page, similar to a Disambiguation page. It gives links to the various transcluded versions available, which is why it doesn't have source buttons. (You can edit the page, but it's more like editing a list article on Wikipedia; not transcluding a work on Wikisource.) These are not generated automatically, so they may be missing versions that are on Wikisource or that have yet to be brought into the project. Generally, they are arranged chronologically, though it would be possible to set them up with a sortable wikitable, but I can't think of an instance where I've seen that done here.

To find other publications of a work, you could try Worldcat (here's the entry for Eliza, for example). There is a lot of duplication and it doesn't mean there's a link to a publicly available scan, but it is a starting point. —Tcr25 (talk) 13:11, 5 February 2025 (UTC)

I can't edit worldcat, I can't even access it. I'm trying to get bibliographic data from Wikisource without interacting with HTML pages. Right now I'm trying to understand what's going on in Wikisource SQL dump. Podbrushkin (talk) 07:33, 10 February 2025 (UTC)

Template:UK Legislation link: Incorporation with Wikidata?

I recently found the useful template of {{UK Legislation link}}, which directs readers to the consolidated versions on legislation.gov.uk. As many British legislation are linked to corresponding Wikidata items, is it possible to modify the template such that it uses links given in Wikidata items? This could save a lot of effort in copy pasting links.

For example, in the text of Scotland Act 1998, one could type {{UK Legislation link|Q1427950}} (Q1427950 is the corresponding item) to call out the link to legislation.gov.uk廣九直通車 (talk) 11:47, 7 February 2025 (UTC)

Yes! I was able to get the template to work with no necessary input parameters by Wikisource users due to the internal links with Wikidata. If a user puts {{UK Legislation link}} in the header of UK legislation, it will automatically find linked Wikidata Q-id, and then pull the linked URL to legislation.gov.uk. This does require the information in Wikidata to be present, and the Wikisource work to be linked in Wikidata, so that information is included in the /doc. The Scotland Act 1998 has this working as of present, and we should be able to add this to all present UK legislation mainspace pages which are linked to an act on Wikidata. Penguin1737 (talk) 03:56, 10 February 2025 (UTC)

Thanks! I'll do this for the rest of other legislation.廣九直通車 (talk) 11:51, 10 February 2025 (UTC)

@Penguin1737: And for your information, I changed property P953 into P3343, which is the legislation.gov.uk ID as recorded. This improves the template, because not all legislation wikidata entries contains a proper link, and some legislation contains more than one link, but almost all will have P3343, which is related to the website.廣九直通車 (talk) 09:08, 11 February 2025 (UTC)

Sourcing two missing pages for Aristotle volume

Index:Works of Aristotle - vol. 1, ed. Ross - 1928 (djvu, worksofaristotle01arisuoft).djvu is missing a page between 51 and 52 (the paging convention is unconventional but the clear difference in both pages is that ch. 12 and 13 are missing). I've been unable to find another djvu copy for precisely volume 1 besides the one already uploaded (which is from IA, which also is missing the two pages), but I have access to a physical copy of this book through my university. Should another djvu/pdf of the pages prove difficult to find/source, I in theory could take pictures of the missing pages. Would this be the likely route? Overthrows (talk) 23:21, 10 February 2025 (UTC)

The pages appear to be here: https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uc1.32106006348566&seq=52 . Typically we insert the missing pages and upload a revised djvu with an updated note about the sourcing. MarkLSteadman (talk) 01:12, 11 February 2025 (UTC)

Sweet! Thank you for finding it. Should I ask the Scan Lab to further work with adding the pages? Overthrows (talk) 01:21, 11 February 2025 (UTC)

Up to you with your comfort level working with djvu files. MarkLSteadman (talk) 01:27, 11 February 2025 (UTC)

Statutes of the Realm: page images not showing on macos

Most of the PDFs of the 'Statutes of the Realm' series uploaded to Wikisource are not displaying page images in the editor, on Firefox & Safari on MacOS. Nor does the automatic transcription work. It does work on Firefox on Linux. I haven't found this problem with any other item on wikisource.

For example: Index:The Statutes of the Realm Vol 8 (1702-7).pdf

(Volume 1 is showing properly, but not the others.) Technolalia (talk) 08:27, 11 February 2025 (UTC)

Can confirm the issue also occurs on Chrome and Firefox on Windows 11. Vol 8 is nearly 3GB, so possibly this is an issue with the file size in respect to the page editor, and it's just too much to handle? Occasionally clicking on a random page and waiting for a minute, the page image will load for me, but most of the time it doesn't. The auto transcription does not appear to be working regardless. Penguin1737 (talk) 05:22, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

This seems to a hitting a limit in the back-end. I would strongly suggest re-uploading smaller sized scans of the edition concerned.

(see https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/012297566 which is the same edition.) and the work undertaken on Volume 1 can also be migrated.

I've put the Index (bar Volume 1) for the monster sized scans at PD, to further this. ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 08:41, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

Underling across pages

How do I make an underline continue across pages. Maryland Chapter 336 - 2023RS for reference. ToxicPea (talk) 02:57, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

You could use {{hws}} and {{hwe}}. See the note at Template:Hyphenated word start#Formatting about how to do it. —Tcr25 (talk) 13:48, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

Can you show me how to do that. I can't seem to get it to work. ToxicPea (talk) 14:39, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

I was assuming this was for a hyphenated word. Is that correct? If so, on the first page you could use {{hws|{{u|begin}}|beginning}} and on the second page {{u|{{hwe|ning|beginning}}}} (the formatting is in the first element on the first page and the full element on the second page. If this is for running text, I'm not sure; you might be able to hack hws/hwe to do it but that would add a hyphen in the page space. —Tcr25 (talk) 15:09, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

This isn't for a hyphenated word. It's for an underlined sentence that continues across pages. ToxicPea (talk) 15:12, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

What about using {{peh}} with a non-breaking space? Something like this {{peh|{{u| }}}}.. —Tcr25 (talk) 15:29, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

That just added a hyphen in mainspace. ToxicPea (talk) 15:50, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

Ok, I just tried using {{upe}} (unspaced page end). I put a non-breaking space within your underline at the of the last word and then used {{upe}}. There is probably cleaner way to handle it, but that seems to have done it. —Tcr25 (talk) 16:03, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

Feels like a stupid question, but how about we just do {{underline|end of page}} on the first page, and {{underline|start of page}} on the second? We can add a   if the problem is the space not being underlined. — Alien  3
3 3 16:20, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

Just tried that and it doesn't work. It just adds a new underlined space instead of underlining the existing space. ToxicPea (talk) 17:48, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

@ToxicPea: the test index is at Index:Sandbox.djvu. Do what @Tcr25 says, with {{upe}} (that prevents the addition of the non-underlined space). I was basically repeating the same thing.

See here for working test. — Alien  3
3 3 17:49, 12 February 2025 (UTC)

How to deal with newspaper articles without a title?

The title explains it all. I'm currently working on Issue 45 of the The Appari News, recently finishing page 2 of that issue. Although I want to transclude that page to the mainspace, it doesn't have a title. How should I deal with it? Norbillian (talk) 16:33, 14 February 2025 (UTC)

I might do the same thing we do with title-less poems and use part of the first line as a substitute title. --EncycloPetey (talk) 17:23, 14 February 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for the idea! Norbillian (talk) 17:47, 14 February 2025 (UTC)

I believe we talked about that not too long ago. (rummages through archives) Ah, There. Reached the same conclusion there too, first words. — Alien  3
3 3 18:10, 14 February 2025 (UTC)