Appendix talk:Uralic Swadesh lists
Add topicHungarian verbs misquoted
[edit]As documented, inter alia, at the previously linked page http://www.helsinki.fi/~jolaakso/f-h-ety.html , the proper quotation form (used in all serious dictionaries) for Hungarian verbs is NOT the infinitive -- this is used only in constructions like "in order to do something" -- but the 3rd person present singular, which lacks the -ni suffix (but comprises an -ik suffix for reflexive verbs):
| GIVEN HERE | CORRECT FORM |
| inni | iszik |
| enni | eszik |
| feküdni | fekszik |
| lélegezni | lélegzik |
| hallani | hall |
| ütni | üt |
etc., etc.
The reason is that the 3rd person present singular obviously conveys more information about the forms of the verb, e. g. whether the verb is reflexive or not.
This is likewise a common source of confusion for many non-European languages such as Sanskrit. --Sanctacaris 11:51, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Mansi
[edit]I added Mansi words from Timothy Riese's Vogul grammar (→ISBN) published by Lincom Europa. They are written phonetically. It would be better to put these in their cyrillic spellings, but I'm not familiar with the cyrillic alphabet used for Mansi.
--Sborsody 22:11, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
Removed links
[edit]I moved this here from the article. I think the links do not belong (especially the Sumerian one).
Tappancsa, --155.100.234.96 18:21, 17 May 2005 (UTC)
[http://www.ifrance.com/saggiga/LANGUAGE.HTML link Sumerian language and comparison with other proto languages]
[http://www.helsinki.fi/~jolaakso/f-h-ety.html link "Related words" in Finnish and Hungarian ]
--Saggiga 18:12, 4 Jan 2005 (UTC) sorry for the formating, I will arrange this later :-)
Võro
[edit]This is a Swadesh list which compares Estonian and Võro. Maybe sombody can attach it to the table of Finno-Ugric languages? Võrok
| Eesti | Võro |
| mina | mina |
| sina | sina |
| tema | timä |
| meie | miiq |
| teie | tiiq |
| nemad | nimäq |
| see | seo, taa |
| too | tuu |
| siin | siin, tan |
| seal | sääl |
| kes | kiä |
| mis | miä |
| kus | kon |
| millal | kunas |
| kuidas | kuis, kui |
| ei, mitte | ei, joht |
| kõik | kõik |
| palju, mitu | pall'o, mitu |
| mõni, mõned | mõni, mõnõq |
| mõni | mõni |
| teine, muu | tõõnõ, muu |
| üks | üts |
| kaks | kats |
| kolm | kolm |
| neli | neli |
| viis | viis |
| suur | suur |
| pikk | pikk |
| lai | lag'a |
| paks | paks |
| raske | rassõ |
| väike | väiku |
| lühike | lühkü, lühüq |
| kitsas | ahtagõnõ, ahas |
| õhuke, peenike | ohku, ohuq. piinü |
| naine | naanõ |
| mees | miis |
| inimene | inemine |
| laps | lats |
| naine | naanõ |
| abikaasa, mees | miis |
| ema | imä |
| isa | esä |
| loom | elläi |
| kala | kala |
| lind | tsirk |
| koer | pini |
| täi | täi |
| madu, uss | huss, siug |
| uss | huss, vagõl |
| puu | puu |
| mets | mõts |
| kepp | kepp |
| vili, puuvili | vili, puuvili |
| seeme | seemeq |
| leht | leht |
| juur | juur |
| koor | kuur |
| őis, lill | häidseq, lill, ninn |
| rohi | hain, moro |
| köis | köüds |
| nahk | nahk |
| liha | liha |
| veri | veri |
| kont, luu | luu |
| rasv | rasv |
| muna | muna |
| sarv | sarv |
| saba | hand |
| sulg | sulg |
| juus | hius |
| pea | pää |
| kõrv | kõrv |
| silm | silm |
| nina | nõna |
| suu | suu |
| hammas | hammas |
| keel | kiil |
| küüs | küüds |
| jalg | jalg |
| jalg | jalg |
| põlv | põlv |
| käsi | käsi |
| tiib | siib |
| kőht | kõtt |
| sisikond, soolikad | sisekund, sooligu |
| kael | kaal |
| selg | sälg |
| rind | rõnd |
| süda | süä |
| maks | mass |
| jooma | juuma |
| sööma | süümä |
| hammustama | haukama |
| imema | imemä, nudsima |
| sülitama | sülgämä |
| oksendama | ossõndama |
| puhuma | puhkma |
| hingama | hengämä |
| naerma | naardma |
| nägema | nägemä |
| kuulma | kuuldma |
| teadma | tiidmä |
| mőtlema | mõtlõma |
| haistma | haistma |
| kartma | pelgämä |
| magama | magama, magahama |
| elama | elämä |
| surema | kuulma |
| tapma | tapma |
| vőitlema, kaklema | taplõma, kiskma |
| küttima | jahtma |
| lööma | lüümä |
| lõikama | lõikama |
| lõhestama | lahki ajama, lahksama |
| kratsima, sügama | süütmä |
| kaevama | kaibma |
| ujuma | ujoma. oidma |
| lendama | lindama |
| kőndima | kõndma |
| tulema | tulõma |
| valetama | võlsma |
| istuma | istma |
| seisma | saisma |
| pöörama, keerama | püürdma, käändmä |
| kukkuma, langema | sadama |
| andma | andma |
| hoidma | hoitma |
| (kokku) suruma, pressima | presma |
| hõõruma | hõõrdma |
| pesema | mõskma |
| pühkima | pühkmä |
| tõmbama | tõmbama |
| tõukama, lükkama | kukkama |
| heitma | hiitmä |
| siduma | köütmä |
| õmblema | umblõma |
| loendama | lugõma |
| ütlema | ütlema |
| laulma | laulma |
| mängima | mängmä |
| hõljuma, ujuma | hõl'oma |
| voolama | juuskma |
| külmuma | külmämä |
| paistetama | paistuma |
| päike | päiv |
| kuu | kuu |
| täht | täht |
| vesi | vesi |
| vihm | vihm |
| jõgi | jõgi |
| järv | järv |
| meri | meri |
| sool | suul |
| kivi | kivi |
| liiv | liiv |
| tolm | tolm |
| maa | maa |
| pilv | pilv |
| udu | undsõq, udsu |
| taevas | taivas |
| tuul | tuul |
| lumi | lumi |
| jää | ijä |
| suits | sau |
| tuli | tuli |
| tuhk | tuhk |
| põlema | palama |
| tee | tii |
| mägi | mägi |
| punane | verrev |
| roheline | hal'as, rohilinõ |
| kollane | kõllanõ |
| valge | valgõ |
| must | must |
| öö | üü |
| päev | päiv |
| aasta | aastak |
| soe | lämmi |
| külm | külm |
| täis | täüs |
| uus | vahtsõnõ |
| vana | vana |
| hea | hää |
| paha, halb | halv |
| mädanenud | määnüq |
| must, määrdunud | must, mustõnuq |
| sirge, otse | õkv |
| ümar | ümmär |
| terav | terräv |
| nüri, tömp | nühr |
| sile | sille, hille, tasanõ |
| märg | likõ |
| kuiv | kuiv |
| parandama | parandama |
| lähedal | lähkün |
| kauge(l) | kavvõn |
| parem | hüvä |
| vasak | kura |
| juures | man |
| sees | seen |
| koos | üten |
| ja | ja |
| kui | ku |
| sest, seepärast et | selle, tollõ |
| nimi | nimi |
Moksha
[edit]I added Moksha language words missing to the list. I used Мокшень-рузонь валкс (Редакциясь Б.А. Серебренниковонь, А.П. Феоктистовонь, О.Е. Поляковонь). Моску, 1998 →ISBN Minor corrections to Erzya list I made based on Эрзянь-рузонь валкс. Москва, 1993 →ISBN I would better use transcription for Moksha words since Modern Moksha Cyrillic lacks characters for indicating 4 Moksha vowels. --Khazar 08:15, 11 October 2008 (UTC)
Duplicate
[edit]There seems to be a somewhat less-work'd version of his same list here: Appendix:Swadesh lists for Fenno-Ugric languages --Tropylium 11:31, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Kildin Saami
[edit]There's an excellent vocabulary list for Kildin Saami on http://wold.livingsources.org/vocabulary/14 Would anyone be willing to copy words from there to this page? -- Stevey7788 04:41, 8 September 2010 (UTC)
- I've added Northern Sámi words from http://www.uta.fi/~km56049/same/svocab.html Hope you guys find it useful. Stevey7788 02:12, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
Selkup/Nenets
[edit]How about renaming this page to Appendix:Swadesh lists for Uralic languages and adding Selkup and/or Nenets? — Stevey7788 02:56, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
Mordvin
[edit]I wonder about the Mordvin words, for they differ from all sources known to me Collinder:81, Rédei:542). HJJHolm (talk) 08:33, 1 May 2012 (UTC)
Reliability
[edit]Hungarian, Finnish, Karelian, Estonian, Erzya, Moksha, Komi (Zyrian dialect), North Mansi and North Sami are not the best choice to represent relations between Uralic languages. Finnish, Karelian and Estonian are basically 3 different official standards of the same dialect group, Erzya and Moksha as well. You should not ignore Khanty, Mari and Samoyed groups only because it's more difficult to find data for them.
Ordering of languages
[edit]I notice that Hungarian is the first language on the list going from left to right. I'm curious as to why this is the case, seeing as its closest relative, Mansi, is significantly further right on the header. I'm aware that it would take a lot of editing to make the order seem more coherent, but it is peculiar nonetheless. Same with the Saami languages: it's pretty well agreed upon that they are closer to Finnic than they are to Ugric, so why put them between Mansi and Nenets? AnonymousMusician (talk) 00:23, 7 November 2018 (UTC)