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Venomoir | INFP | lvl31 | she/they

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s5 will byers defender currently in my bychance era

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BYCHANCE TIMELINE - speculative theory

This goes by the hand of what I've shown before here. This theory is just a small part of a larger narrative, and whereas Will's arc is central, his relationship with his friends and family will be crucial this season. So what you're seeing here is me trying to narrow down what I believe his arc with Chance, specifically, will entail. I see this as one of the loops Will needs to break to Be Free--one storyline ingrained into a larger narrative--its not what the season will focus on entirely, but an important aspect of it.

ACT I. Bychance introduced in EP1

Full circle moment as Bychance joins the narrative pattern established through Stancy, Mileven & even Joyce and Lonnie--which I'll be calling Jonnie for short. They start off with Will reading a note [ left in his locker ], with a time and place to meet. Then we see them together. This rattles the audience a bit--some will actually approve ( like they did Mileven & Stancy ), some might cheer bc it means their ship's endgame now that Will has an 'official love interest' ( Milevens ), some might question if this is real/a vecna vision or something, and others ( Bylers ) question it and are taken aback bc this might feel ooc of Will to them. Which it is, yes, but that's kind of the point.

He's conforming half-way. He refuses to date a girl and lie about who he is, yes, but at the same time he's sneaking around with a jock/bully, who is part of the group that tormented Hellfire in S4, nonetheless. And, just like Nancy did Steve in S1, makes excuses for his behavior. ( callback to S1 )

"He's a good guy deep down, he just needs some time to come to terms with who he is. It's not like I have options, anyway. What are the odds of meeting someone else like me in this town?"

In Will's case, the van scene was a metaphorical self-sacrifice. A part of Will, a very important part of him, died in that van--not to mention the whole forgotten birthday thing. So he's now trying, forcing himself to move on and find coping mechanisms.

However, I really do think the point of Bychance is to serve as a lesson, yes, but also to give Will a little bit of a 'vacation' and allow him to live a little, damn. He surely deserves a break.

ACT II. Flashback to their first meeting

The details of their first encounter remain to be seen but we either see them get together in real time ( aka this happens before we see them kiss ) or we see a flashback of their first meeting, which might be similar to Mileven's ( it happens by chance--pun intended--in a way that feels cold, it's raining, there's danger looming, etc ). However, Bychance might mirror BenChar from Heartstopper more than Mileven's first scene. The reason being that it is widely accepted within the town that Will is queer and we even have bullies in S1 talk about Will's queerness ( potential S1 callback here? ), so it might be safe to assume that Chance is aware of the possibility of Will being queer and at some point the opportunity presents itself, and the two exchange words. I expect coded language being used, reinforcing one of the show's themes.

"Is it true what they say about you? That you're ... yknow. Different."

I'm putting BenChar here as a very loose example, because I don't think Will would get outed like Charlie--the truth is he never even had the luxury of hiding to begin with. As far as we understand, everyone just knew. I also assume the show would show us moments of Will trying to connect with Chance/talk to him but Chance doesn't seem interested in that, like Ben with Charlie, and then the reality begins to sip through--this isn't real, Will is just looking for a replacement for Mike. Sound familiar? Because if we see S5 Bychance paralleling S1 Mileven ... yikes.

Another theme that BenChar has in common with Stranger Things is the idea of secrecy--which is basically what Mike had to do in S1, hide Eleven and therefore his relationship with her. Not out of malice, but for safety reasons. Chance and Will would be in the exact same spot. Again, if there are noticeable parallels ... yikes.

However, I'm not sure what exact vibe Chance brings to the table, but he definitely cannot come across too intense bc it'll spook Will. So he needs to be stealthy, like a ninja. ( Like yknow, how Steve said as he crawled through Nancy's window in S1 that he was 'stealthy like a ninja' and like in S2 when he said to Dustin that some girls like you to be aggressive like a lion, but others like you to be stealthy like a ninja ).

To Chance, Will is a conquest, but he might be like Ben as in he's not totally unredeemable--and if subtextually he's supposed to be this personification of Will's trauma, then we can expect he reminds Will of Lonnie, Vecna and ... Mike. Just like how Mike reminded El of Brenner, Hopper, etc. Yay, more WillEl parallels.

Lonnie = father figure--he's in Joyce's S1 shoes here. He feels like he's losing his mind. ( Either due to old UD trauma, new UD trauma recall, irl trauma, or bc of the van scene. Or everything. It depends on how much angst the Duffers want S5 to have. )--so when Chance comes knocking at his door, he lets him in, initially thinking he's making a choice for himself. Vecna = someone who used his mind and body for his own purposes. Mike = an illusion, a lie/fantasy. ( as per s4, this is what Will currently believes ).

Similarly to BenChar, Chance might act out the tough and roudy bully in public, and pretend Will doesn't exist, but then be sweet in private.

This is also in a way similar to Stancy, where Steve offered something more surface-level and encouraged Nancy to suppress her feelings instead of expressing them, even if that wasn't his intention. And similarly, El didn't show interest in Mike's hobbies when he tried to introduce them to her--not El's fault, she simply wasn't interested.

ACT III. Bychance getting caught ( by either Mike or Jonathan? ) 

Mike/Jonathan is investigating something related to the supernatural, or going some place and sees Bychance by pure chance ( this stops being funny after a while ), connecting with: Jonathan seeing Nancy with Steve in S1 Jonathan finding Jonnie in an uncomfortable position in S1 And thus helping the narrative come full circle. If we want to say it is a combination between these two, then my bet is, it is Mike who finds them. Mike sees his Will, with someone else ... yikes. But also, he sees him .. with another guy. In a compromising position. I'll ... talk about Mike later since he's the most puzzling to me, but for now I'll just say I think it's a VERY different thing if he'd seen Will with a girl. If he had, total drama queen tantrum, but with another guy?? Oh boy.

But back to Will--The implication of bychance paralleling or being contrasted with Jonnie is the idea of returning to a toxic place out of desperation & for comfort--a coping mechanism. i,e Will's relationship with Chance is the consequence of and is shaped by Will's UD + irl trauma. This dynamic gives Will a false sense of control and perpetuates what he began in the van scene--he's still Will, but is making the wrong choices. Gotta love consequences.

I also don't know how far the show will go depicting this dynamic--my guess is worst case scenario it goes all the way like Stancy, but it could also be like Jonnie where it falls apart before it goes too far. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

ACT IV. Roles reverse--Chance sees Mike and Will sharing a tender moment after Will has a traumatic experience?

This moment with Nancy was right after her encounter with the tree, so maybe something related to that tree we're seeing Will associated with? Also, I have no idea where this scene would take place logically--I have 0 clue where the Byers are staying after all. But somewhere where Chance could realistically go to. This scene with Stancy was after Steve wasn't too supportive of Nancy and went to apologize to her house, but then saw Jonathan and Nancy together--his reaction was to break Jonathan's camera. So this could maybe have something to do with the scenes surrounding the bullies that we have seen. If Chance at some point is an active participant in a force that hurts the party to get back at Mike/(Will) then this could be what sets Will up for the final Bychance act.

And I know that adding Chance to the mix might appear as just more drama for Byler but imagine the golden opportunity here to 'show don't tell' the audience through a third party that has stakes on the situation. Because it's not the same if Jonathan or Karen or anyone sees them together, there's room for plausible deniability there.

But the boyfriend of one of them seeing and getting jealous? Yeah that says he saw something there that the audience should be seeing too. Because what if it's like ... a combination between this scene and S2 Mike giving Will comfort and holding his hand?

Now this could technically be done through El too--and there's a parallel in S2 where she got jealous over Mike and Max even though there wasn't anything truly there. But quite frankly I think that was something that they'd have done with S4 El.

ACT V. The break-up ( the closing & breaking of the cycle )

So, I'm not entirely sure about the flow of this yet bc part of me also wonders if they'll just kill off Chance like they did Bob in the middle of the action or something. Yikes. Hell, maybe Will gets possessed by Vecna and kills Chance himself, who the hell knows. This could go SO MANY WAYS.

But I do hope we see a moment of catharsis for Will where he chooses to reclaim his self-worth. That feels more to me like the point of Chance as well.

My current guess is perhaps the energy of this scene is a combination between BenChar and Jonnie, with Will being angry and hurt and finally realizing he deserves, and wants, better than this. More than this. Chance is a test he must pass before he's ready to face off against Vecna AND get together with Mike ( which will probably happen towards the end for sure ).

And perhaps the Duffers will go with the concept of 'chance' in its metaphorical context, and I'm way too attached to the pacing and tone of S1, but considering all of the S1 callbacks we saw in S4 ... there's just something so compelling and powerful to me about Will having a previous romantic experience before getting with his One True Love. Otherwise Byler risks feeling too ... perfect to me in a way that feels ... stiff. But maybe I'm wrong and they have a better way to do it than Bychance!

I just honestly cannot shake these:

Our first impression of Chance being him wearing the number 22. Lucas saying 'I'm tired of feeling like a loser, so now we have that chance' with a poster that says "MEET AT"

Tigers ( jock + cheerleader ) making out next to an INVITATION to a GAME with a day + time.

Jason asking if Mike Is Somewhere, "by chance". It's giving Deadpool level of self-awareness & meta, it's giving Shawn Levy. Who worked on that movie, btw. And is the dude who said this:

"Without getting into where we go later in season 4 [Volume II], I guess I'll just say that there aren't many accidents on Stranger Things," Levy tells EW when asked about Will's sexuality. "There is clear intention and strategy and real thought given to each and every character. So, if you came away from Volume I feeling those bread crumbs of plot and character, it's probably no accident." source

Oh, so you mean me perceiving the tigers are heavily queercoded might've been intentional, strategic and really thought out? And sure, that might not really mean anything Bychance related, or it might just mean something else. But the scene of Lucas in Hawkins and Will in rink-o-mania being connected through music ...?

And then we just saw Chance on the scene, inviting people over to party, and a Chance/Mike lookalike extra behind Will with a shirt that says 'I love contact sports'? Really?

Really?

It's giving 'happy belated birthday, Will!'

I know I'm delusional af atp I do not even trust myself, it's 6.00am and I just needed to get this out before the self-doubt crept up on me again, but it is becoming clearer to me how Bychance fits into the narrative--and it is so seamless to me that im over here like LET'S GO TIGERS, LETS GO TIGERS

I don't know, man. I don't know. But either way, this is fun as hell, which is the point of analysis, no? Regardless of whether or not this happens, or does so in a metaphorical way, we'll see!

Will's s5 arc as per the newer leaks

goddamn it. I was already theorizing that Will's actions are going to be subconsciously manipulated by Vecna, and these statements are very congruent with that idea.

this person also 'debunked' Bychance ( though the way i see bychance, it's not meant to be a long-term or endgame plotline where Will and him are portrayed all lovey-dovey, and this person being vague about 'some aspects' being right also kind of makes me raise by eyebrow. ) so for now, i'll carry on with bychance bc as is, it is what makes sense to me.

however, this aside, i'm not fully on board with trusting leakers whether i like what they're saying or not until i see the show with my own two eyes ( or official things such as teasers, trailers, etc ) because these CAN be inferred ( like i did ) if you have a decent understanding of the show.

in fact, upon a rewatch of S4EP4 i noticed some 'parallels' between Viktor Creel and Will--as in, both of them being The First Survivors of Vecna in their own right.

( adding my own quick drawing here bc i literally thought of this by the mention of 'snappy dialogue' in the leaks )

but let's say both this person and i are correct--then yeah, will is going to be in need of some type of coping mechanism, ( and the chances of it being unhealthy are high, since I REALLY doubt the show will picture him going to therapy and it actually helping him, or doing other stuff like meditation, journaling, etc. not to mention i don't think he'll be drawing this time like i explained in this post )

if he just pushes on putting this amount of weight onto himself without anyone intervening or even knowing how to help ( like the bit about the birds suggests ), he'll drive himself straight into vecna's arms. as a matter of fact, I'm pretty sure that's what Vecna is expecting. he won't have to move a muscle when it comes to Will, not really.

and i fucking HATE the goddamn implication of vecna needing will for something still bc the mental picture i get is really freaking violent and wish i could delete it from my subconscious. the leaker mentioned something with fire. and it can be fire or whatever it is but i get the feeling it has something to do with causing will extreme pain. ugh.

so a bychance arc ( or whoever, honestly. atp just give my boy SOMETHING to help alleviate the weight he's carrying ) feels fitting to me as some sort of 'training' for his self-worth and whatnot as he faces off against vecna.

its so frustrating knowing i have 0 control over my favorite character's destiny and it is stressing me out so bad i'm going to need therapy myself by the end of this. ugh

but still, im staying strong on my stance about bychance until the Actual Show comes out.

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either vecna subtext and byler doubt got me down so bad i made up an imaginary short-term boyfriend for will to cope, or this bychance thing is real bc tell me why its increased my own awareness of myself and the show im going insane

SAY SIKE the way i've tapped into some long-buried organization skills of my own thanks to this theory truly makes me think im onto something

i literally will not shut up about it bc chance as a character has been marinating in the show im sure of it *puts nancy brain mode on*

watch my shot in the dark ( as if there wasn't evidence lmao ) be a bulls eye

I’m 100% with you on this one no matter what other ppl say lmfao. Like the hints are actually insane.

And I CANNOT for the life of me COMPREHEND just how so many bylers are somehow missing the level of juicy & exciting this plotline would be for both Mike & Will’s character arcs like….

Obviously Byler is the endgame. No sane person is denying that.

But I highly doubt Byler is going to have the linear & easy & quick & peaceful resolution so many ppl are apparently expecting.

THERE ARE GOING TO BE UNEXPECTED TWISTS AND THERE IS GOING TO BE CONFLICT AND THERE IS GOING TO BE JEALOUSY AND THERE IS GOING TO BE ANGST.

It also makes 100% sense for:

Will’s “trying to get over Mike & pushing him away” while “experimenting sexually” & probably related to his SA trauma arc;

Mike’s jealousy/ possessiveness/ insecurity/ internalised homophobia arc;

— the very soul of Byler’s relationship & how it always ends up overcoming obstacles no matter what gets in their way & tries to keep them apart. Them being able to eventually overcome this would be yet another testament to their true love & soulmatism.

— and an infinite myriad of other stuff, such as the conformity & non-conformity themes in Stranger Things, how even inside “conservative/ popular” circles there are outcasts (such as Chance would be in the basketball team), how vulnerable ppl back then took sexual risks, the dangers & stigma of AIDS, the entire ignorance around sexuality, how past trauma shapes current behavior & self-sabotage, the way they’ve been foreshadowing some kind of Judas/“traitor” plotline & how this would apply to Will “betraying” his friends by getting involved with a basketball player (*ahem* mainly Mike cuz he’d be boiling with jealousy lol), the callback to Nancy getting involved with Steve in s1, the way this arc was literally foreshadowed/ paralleled through “Lucas on the Line” & s4 Lucas while nobody understood his perspective & struggle…

and I could go on & on…

AND DEEP DOWN IN YOUR HEART YOU GUYS KNOW DAMN WELL I’M SPEAKING FACTS! Lol

THE CONFORMITY THING. EXACTLY. Get behind me, seriously!!

Will won't try to pretend to be straight like others might, but he'd still be participating in forced conforming in SOME WAY.

"there's not enough time to---" IF WILL WANTS TO PLAY HOOKIE, HE WILL MAKE TIME.

imagine how ironic it'd be to rewatch S1 and watch this scene where Hopper said that 'Will was probably just playing hookie' and we know that's EXACTLY what he was doing at some point in S5. talk about a FULL CIRCLE, META moment. As crazy as it might sound rn, i bet that's within the ballpark of that 'rewind' effect the show is likely striving for.

not to mention as much as i loved byler, analyzed it and spent hours upon hours rewatching the show and theorizing, i was NEVER 100% convinced that they were endgame UNTIL BYCHANCE CAME INTO THE PICTURE

the way things connect so seamlessly is making my organization-oriented brain so happy with this theory. it just Makes Logical Sense

and sure, there could be another way the duffers go about it blah blah BUT SHOW ME THE EVIDENCE. SHOW. ME. THE EVIDENCE. PRESENT IT TO ME IN A WAY THAT MAKES LOGICAL SENSE and i'll change my mind about this.

I'M OVER HERE DRAWING BYCHANCE. my art ( as is for Will lmao ) is SO personal and i would NOT waste my time DRAWING for it if I didn't genuinely think there was a chance it'd happen.

i NEVER drew byler for that very same reason. But Bychance? atp, if no bychance, then no byler

bc it's the same damn logic. but Bychance brings it up a notch. bc it really is for THE BRAVE.

either vecna subtext and byler doubt got me down so bad i made up an imaginary short-term boyfriend for will to cope, or this bychance thing is real bc tell me why its increased my own awareness of myself and the show im going insane

SAY SIKE the way i've tapped into some long-buried organization skills of my own thanks to this theory truly makes me think im onto something

i literally will not shut up about it bc chance as a character has been marinating in the show im sure of it *puts nancy brain mode on*

watch my shot in the dark ( as if there wasn't evidence lmao ) be a bulls eye

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ST5 MAY LEAKS

Willkommen, bienvenue, welcome

Fremde, etranger, stranger

Glukich zu sehen, je suis enchante, happy to see you

Bleibe, reste, stay

THIS FITS SO WELL WITH MY THOUGHTS ABOUT WILL BEING SUBCONSCIOUSLY MANIPULATED BY VECNA/NOT REMEMBERING THINGS PROPERLY DUE TO TRAUMA ( rl + ud ) AND LEADING THE GROUP IN THE WRONG DIRECTION AT TIMES AND BEING TOO HARD ON HIMSELF FOR IT BC HE 'SHOULD KNOW BETTER' AND THATS DESTROYING HIM OH MY GOD

HE REALLY MEANT IT WHEN HE SAID 'WITHOUT HEART, WE'D ALL FALL APART' BC HE'S ACTING BASED ON A VERSION OF HIMSELF HE'S FORCING/THINKS HE SHOULD BE LIKE, BC HIS HEART'S SHATTERED

HE'S TRYING TO FAKE IT TIL HE MAKES IT

BYCHANCE SLIDES DOC ( pls read to participate! )

hello, everyone! so i'm working on a bychance slides doc ( please don't crucify me, bylers. its for my own mental sanity atp ) and im currently at the organization & collection of evidence stage--i'm at a point where i'd really like to share this to get input from anyone who might've been following along! ( as in, please roast it LMAO ) atp this is a hybrid between a theory and a fanfic--and a 'sub-byler' theory, honestly. i'd also love some help gathering screenshots and whatnot ( cries ) if anyone would be up for it!

who the heck knows what i'm actually cooking here but i'm following my gut.

right now it is still a wip since I'm just setting up, but i'm developing visual aid to present the ideas here, here and here in a way that is more efficient and fun.

i'm tagging a few people who've commented on my posts & who have shown interest in bychance in general in case they're interested but this post is open to anyone and everyone ( just be nice i beg you, i wish i was joking when i said i'm questioning my sanity rn and just need to get all of this out lmfaooo ) and at some point i'd love to also incorporate any ideas you may have if you'd like them featured there!

if you're interested, just dm me! if you have a discord that'd be even better since i might use that as our primary communication place thingy. ty for reading <3

damn, can't wait to go back home and keep working on my bychance master doc

i started it like 2 nights ago and it's been the most fun ive had in a WHILE ....

that alone makes me an unstoppable force

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So, Bychance is on my radar and ... I think it'll actually happen.

Disclaimer, I realize this is me going full unhinged mode and some of this might be because I'm so bored lately but the more I think about where we left Will off in S4, the more I think Will might actually take a chance ( lmao? ) to be with someone new, even if deep down he knows it's not in his best interests--it'll be more a coping mechanism, an attempt to move on from Mike, and without realizing he might be repeating the pattern of his parent's relationship due to trauma.

This will ultimately result in growth for him, of course, and the breaking of these cycles. Will Byers will be free in the end, but the road there won't be easy.

So here we go--by the leaks of Holly being taken, and the outfits they are wearing, we can infer S5 Byler will mirror S1 Jancy.

Yeah. And how did Nancy start S1?

Having a one-time, two-time secretive thing with a jock ( bully ) that left a note in her locker at the start of the season.

Something something bullies leaving a note in Will's locker at the start of the season.

Something something a bully leaving a note at the start of S5 in Will's locker with a place and time to meet.

And what is one of the most noticeable things that Stancy and Mileven have in common?

Yeah, they start seemingly very passionate, only to fall apart later. Add Bychance to that mix.

Now, about the place and time where Chance and Will likely secretly meet. At first I thought it would be Benny's Burger.

Benny's Burger, which also foreshadows Mike telling Eleven something about her Benny Burger's t-shirt in EP9. It is also established in these screenshots that Benny's Burger is a place commonly used for people to hang out, likely teenagers, to engage in illegal things like drinking ( and probably more, the 69 poster above Lucas' head notwithstanding )

We also have the whole 'WE ❤️ TIGERS' posters, and Christmas Lights which we have come to associate with Will, as it has been established that this is Will's favorite holiday as well.

However, Chance and Will would have to be extra careful not to get caught, so chances are they'll go for places that aren't frequented ...

Now, the main question is, why Chance? And I'll admit this is all oh so fairly loose and likely a reach, but if we are to believe Will is going to have a secret thing with a bully, then out of all of the ones introduced in S4, Chance is the one that I'd dare to say we can connect Will with through symbolism, albeit vague.

The first time we see Chance, we see the poster 'Defeat The Falcons' closer to him than anyone else on the team even though he was on the bench.

Now, correct me if Im wrong, but if there is an association with Mike and falcons, then it could hint at Mike having lost to chance this season. Foreshadowing he loses to a literal Chance next season? Since Chance didn't come out the bench this season. Yikes. Good luck, Mike. You're gonna need it.

We also notice he's sporting the number 22 in his shirt ( which considering the attention brought to t-shirts this season, I'd say this means something, especially bc 22 is Will's birthday and it is also speculated to be the date of the Creel Murders -- Chance and Will meeting at the Creel House oh god ... ).

Speaking of 22, this scene is interconnected with Will in California through music--it does have a similar context in which both Lucas and Will feel abandoned by their friends. But we also see what you could argue is an extra that is supposed to remind us of Chance behind Will wearing a shirt ( again with the shirts ) that says 'I love contact sports'

Moments before, we *just* saw Chance next to Lucas, in the same spot we see Mike as well--as if the two are being compared. ( Tiger vs Falcon? )

We know Will is associated with tigers, but we can also infer that he loves tigers, which connects him to the 'WE ❤️ YOU TIGERS' poster in Benny's Burgers.

This is as far as I have gone in my analysis, but I might rewatch S1 and S3 at one point to follow along the narrative patterns and see if I can uncover more.

My guess right now is if Bychance is established early on, then it might go for about a couple episodes before it inevitably crashes and burns--with Will being the one to end things, and then Byler happens at the end in a way that pays off.

This is crazy. Letting this person cook with this one

thank you, im in the trenches rn ... it's probably only a matter of time before my people turn against me i can sense it in the air, but i have to follow my gut instinct there's just something going on here

Don't worry ur not alone in this 😭 I be thinking about this stuff and I'm like "THIS MAKES SO MUCH SENSE THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN IM NOT DELUSIONAL" 💀 but it's good to follow ur gut cuz u never know

oh god thank god for you rn seriously haha, the reason why i'm kinda scared rn is bc i started working on bychance for fun but now im like 'oh my god' and i started working on a master slides last night and ... honestly there's some compelling stuff there but i'm kind of bracing myself to be booed out of the byler tag, which is the worst case scenario.

IT'S SO SCARY IM LIKE SO TENDER

but something tells me to keep going, idk ...

AWW NOO ITS OKAY DONT BE SCARED😭 I'm sure nothing will happen, I mean you haven't been booed at in ur previous post and if smth does happen I'll defend u!! Lol

Just do ur thing, whats wrong with having fun right?

YOURE TOO SWEET FR *holds ur hand* youre probably right tbh!! this theory is just sm fun and ... therapeutic??? like damn, i need will to be given a *bit* of a break yknow? hes gone through sm

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So, Bychance is on my radar and ... I think it'll actually happen.

Disclaimer, I realize this is me going full unhinged mode and some of this might be because I'm so bored lately but the more I think about where we left Will off in S4, the more I think Will might actually take a chance ( lmao? ) to be with someone new, even if deep down he knows it's not in his best interests--it'll be more a coping mechanism, an attempt to move on from Mike, and without realizing he might be repeating the pattern of his parent's relationship due to trauma.

This will ultimately result in growth for him, of course, and the breaking of these cycles. Will Byers will be free in the end, but the road there won't be easy.

So here we go--by the leaks of Holly being taken, and the outfits they are wearing, we can infer S5 Byler will mirror S1 Jancy.

Yeah. And how did Nancy start S1?

Having a one-time, two-time secretive thing with a jock ( bully ) that left a note in her locker at the start of the season.

Something something bullies leaving a note in Will's locker at the start of the season.

Something something a bully leaving a note at the start of S5 in Will's locker with a place and time to meet.

And what is one of the most noticeable things that Stancy and Mileven have in common?

Yeah, they start seemingly very passionate, only to fall apart later. Add Bychance to that mix.

Now, about the place and time where Chance and Will likely secretly meet. At first I thought it would be Benny's Burger.

Benny's Burger, which also foreshadows Mike telling Eleven something about her Benny Burger's t-shirt in EP9. It is also established in these screenshots that Benny's Burger is a place commonly used for people to hang out, likely teenagers, to engage in illegal things like drinking ( and probably more, the 69 poster above Lucas' head notwithstanding )

We also have the whole 'WE ❤️ TIGERS' posters, and Christmas Lights which we have come to associate with Will, as it has been established that this is Will's favorite holiday as well.

However, Chance and Will would have to be extra careful not to get caught, so chances are they'll go for places that aren't frequented ...

Now, the main question is, why Chance? And I'll admit this is all oh so fairly loose and likely a reach, but if we are to believe Will is going to have a secret thing with a bully, then out of all of the ones introduced in S4, Chance is the one that I'd dare to say we can connect Will with through symbolism, albeit vague.

The first time we see Chance, we see the poster 'Defeat The Falcons' closer to him than anyone else on the team even though he was on the bench.

Now, correct me if Im wrong, but if there is an association with Mike and falcons, then it could hint at Mike having lost to chance this season. Foreshadowing he loses to a literal Chance next season? Since Chance didn't come out the bench this season. Yikes. Good luck, Mike. You're gonna need it.

We also notice he's sporting the number 22 in his shirt ( which considering the attention brought to t-shirts this season, I'd say this means something, especially bc 22 is Will's birthday and it is also speculated to be the date of the Creel Murders -- Chance and Will meeting at the Creel House oh god ... ).

Speaking of 22, this scene is interconnected with Will in California through music--it does have a similar context in which both Lucas and Will feel abandoned by their friends. But we also see what you could argue is an extra that is supposed to remind us of Chance behind Will wearing a shirt ( again with the shirts ) that says 'I love contact sports'

Moments before, we *just* saw Chance next to Lucas, in the same spot we see Mike as well--as if the two are being compared. ( Tiger vs Falcon? )

We know Will is associated with tigers, but we can also infer that he loves tigers, which connects him to the 'WE ❤️ YOU TIGERS' poster in Benny's Burgers.

This is as far as I have gone in my analysis, but I might rewatch S1 and S3 at one point to follow along the narrative patterns and see if I can uncover more.

My guess right now is if Bychance is established early on, then it might go for about a couple episodes before it inevitably crashes and burns--with Will being the one to end things, and then Byler happens at the end in a way that pays off.

This is crazy. Letting this person cook with this one

thank you, im in the trenches rn ... it's probably only a matter of time before my people turn against me i can sense it in the air, but i have to follow my gut instinct there's just something going on here

Don't worry ur not alone in this 😭 I be thinking about this stuff and I'm like "THIS MAKES SO MUCH SENSE THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN IM NOT DELUSIONAL" 💀 but it's good to follow ur gut cuz u never know

oh god thank god for you rn seriously haha, the reason why i'm kinda scared rn is bc i started working on bychance for fun but now im like 'oh my god' and i started working on a master slides last night and ... honestly there's some compelling stuff there but i'm kind of bracing myself to be booed out of the byler tag, which is the worst case scenario.

IT'S SO SCARY IM LIKE SO TENDER

but something tells me to keep going, idk ...

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So, Bychance is on my radar and ... I think it'll actually happen.

Disclaimer, I realize this is me going full unhinged mode and some of this might be because I'm so bored lately but the more I think about where we left Will off in S4, the more I think Will might actually take a chance ( lmao? ) to be with someone new, even if deep down he knows it's not in his best interests--it'll be more a coping mechanism, an attempt to move on from Mike, and without realizing he might be repeating the pattern of his parent's relationship due to trauma.

This will ultimately result in growth for him, of course, and the breaking of these cycles. Will Byers will be free in the end, but the road there won't be easy.

So here we go--by the leaks of Holly being taken, and the outfits they are wearing, we can infer S5 Byler will mirror S1 Jancy.

Yeah. And how did Nancy start S1?

Having a one-time, two-time secretive thing with a jock ( bully ) that left a note in her locker at the start of the season.

Something something bullies leaving a note in Will's locker at the start of the season.

Something something a bully leaving a note at the start of S5 in Will's locker with a place and time to meet.

And what is one of the most noticeable things that Stancy and Mileven have in common?

Yeah, they start seemingly very passionate, only to fall apart later. Add Bychance to that mix.

Now, about the place and time where Chance and Will likely secretly meet. At first I thought it would be Benny's Burger.

Benny's Burger, which also foreshadows Mike telling Eleven something about her Benny Burger's t-shirt in EP9. It is also established in these screenshots that Benny's Burger is a place commonly used for people to hang out, likely teenagers, to engage in illegal things like drinking ( and probably more, the 69 poster above Lucas' head notwithstanding )

We also have the whole 'WE ❤️ TIGERS' posters, and Christmas Lights which we have come to associate with Will, as it has been established that this is Will's favorite holiday as well.

However, Chance and Will would have to be extra careful not to get caught, so chances are they'll go for places that aren't frequented ...

Now, the main question is, why Chance? And I'll admit this is all oh so fairly loose and likely a reach, but if we are to believe Will is going to have a secret thing with a bully, then out of all of the ones introduced in S4, Chance is the one that I'd dare to say we can connect Will with through symbolism, albeit vague.

The first time we see Chance, we see the poster 'Defeat The Falcons' closer to him than anyone else on the team even though he was on the bench.

Now, correct me if Im wrong, but if there is an association with Mike and falcons, then it could hint at Mike having lost to chance this season. Foreshadowing he loses to a literal Chance next season? Since Chance didn't come out the bench this season. Yikes. Good luck, Mike. You're gonna need it.

We also notice he's sporting the number 22 in his shirt ( which considering the attention brought to t-shirts this season, I'd say this means something, especially bc 22 is Will's birthday and it is also speculated to be the date of the Creel Murders -- Chance and Will meeting at the Creel House oh god ... ).

Speaking of 22, this scene is interconnected with Will in California through music--it does have a similar context in which both Lucas and Will feel abandoned by their friends. But we also see what you could argue is an extra that is supposed to remind us of Chance behind Will wearing a shirt ( again with the shirts ) that says 'I love contact sports'

Moments before, we *just* saw Chance next to Lucas, in the same spot we see Mike as well--as if the two are being compared. ( Tiger vs Falcon? )

We know Will is associated with tigers, but we can also infer that he loves tigers, which connects him to the 'WE ❤️ YOU TIGERS' poster in Benny's Burgers.

This is as far as I have gone in my analysis, but I might rewatch S1 and S3 at one point to follow along the narrative patterns and see if I can uncover more.

My guess right now is if Bychance is established early on, then it might go for about a couple episodes before it inevitably crashes and burns--with Will being the one to end things, and then Byler happens at the end in a way that pays off.

This is crazy. Letting this person cook with this one

thank you, im in the trenches rn ... it's probably only a matter of time before my people turn against me i can sense it in the air, but i have to follow my gut instinct there's just something going on here

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A small problem about birthdaygate

So, I just realized something about birthdaygate which no one has explained yet 😭. Before I start, I absolutely love birthdaygate, it's my favorite theory and at this point is literally canon. But, what about Will's 16th bday in 1987? S5 takes place in November 1987. Will they go over it or will they also forget his bday that year too?

god, honestly this is a great question! i think i briefly had that confusion too. there are SO MANY things that confuse me as heck about the timeline that i'm kind of just ... deciding not to think too much about it until we get at least a teaser with SOME information

i *guess* ( and i say this loosely ) worst case scenario they forgot it too? goodness grief

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will80sbyers

Will has to still accept himself on screen and they didn't dig into that enough for him to magically be doing gay stuff explicitly with anyone, Mike is the only one he would trust enough to do something like kissing him

i get where you're coming from entirely! tbf tho ( and this is all subject to change as i explore the theory further ) as of right now, bychance is being theorized and explored as will's coping mechanism--entering s5, he'll be operating on the belief that once the painting lie inevitably comes out, he will lose not only mike, but his entire party as well. He expects banishment to be the consequence since 'friend's don't lie' is the most important rule of the party. and what do we know about will?

he's a survivor.

will's coping mechanism so far has been his art, but chances are that, bc his art is now 'tainted' with heartbreak, he'll be experiencing art block like how mike couldn't really bring himself to deliver the same energy in his campaigns after experiencing trauma at the end of S1.

i don't think this means he'll be out to try to find a different party/replacement consciously since Chance will be the one to approach him first. And this would have to be done in a way that would make Will accept the risk of getting to know him. ( as for the writer's intention, i'm thinking its 'training' for will to integrate his shadow before the finale, and also getting some experience/self-knowledge before getting with mike )

and honestly thank god for the writers adding in the scene with Jonathan and Will post-painting reveal bc it opens the door for Will to come to him about this at some point.

tysm for bringing up this very important and valid point! definitely giving me a lot to consider with the way will's internalized homophobia has been depicted so far, since one of the things i've been a bit stuck on is the flow of Chance and Will "getting together."

i'm assuming it would take some sort of S5-plot related event to prompt him to actually go for it, so for now i'm just kinda trusting my gut.

Will, despite being the most sought-after and good looking in the group, has intentionally avoided any romantic flings, flirtations, or casual hookups. While it’s true that Will is the sensitive one who has faced a rough childhood and possibly dealing with feelings of depression, but it's also true that he has made his feelings for Mike clear by painting a heart on Mike's shield. It’s a signal that he's got desires, is capable of love, and longs to be loved.

I’m not completely against Will exploring only and exclusively Mike, Sure, if Mike is Will's first kiss, it would symbolize ONE TRUE LOVE, Mike is THE ONE, with whom Will is destined to be with forevermore. But if he were to kiss someone else (be it a guy or a girl) to realize he wholeheartedly belongs with Mike, it wouldn’t be a terrible thing. Mike has kissed El multiple times, yet Will "gorgeous" Byers has swiped left every time because his boy is busy snogging a girl. He’s been waiting for Mike to end his 'Hetero RPG campaign' (Sorry, Mike, but can’t you see that Will has been waiting for four seasons?! Mister "I’m busy kissing your sister," wake up, buddy! It’s time to set the record straight! Enough now!).

Maybe Robin, who was mismatching Steve and Nancy in s4, tells Will to go out and explore the gay world and give Mr. Chance a try, as they'll be 18+ in S5 with Will stepping into adulthood and would likely want to explore his life a little. But the worst-case setup would be portraying a "Desperate Will", a Will who suddenly jumps at the opportunity to go out with Chance! the same Will who has held off on kissing anyone because he’s fixated solely on Mike!? Not the best arc imo. I don’t want Will to come off like Josie (Drew Barrymore, from Never Been Kissed, desperately longing for a kiss)

Will's character is actually the opposite. He’s popular with the ladies and probably has admirers among the closeted guys at Hawkins High. Also, it would undermine the reason the Duffers chose to portray Will as a chick magnet who, despite having every opportunity, isn’t desperate for social acceptance. He’s likely exhausted by the attention but never desperate. Unless they planned to show a contrast: Mike choosing El because he conformed to heteronormative social norms, while Will didn’t back down despite countless offers from girls. Or, on a lighter note, Mike could be practicing kissing with El to get ready to woo Will later with his newfound smoothness.

The best scenario would be Will turning down offers from girls and Chance right in front of Mike, making it clear,  "What now Mike? what the hell are you waiting for?! Do you need another season to ask me out and hold my hand?!" Or is it.....

HELP omg ty for this input!! let me expand and revise my argument a bit taking this into account bc yeah i don't think we'll see will being desperate/chasing chance either! rather, i think will is going to be in a position where he needs to decide whether or not he takes the chance ( lmao? ) to be with someone else or not. ( & i also think the reason why he's turned down girls is bc he just Doesn't Like Them. Remember what Jonathan said to him in S1? He shouldn't like things bc people tell him he's supposed to. )

whether he goes to someone else for advice, or makes the decision on his own bc of his trust issues, i'm not sure yet, only time will tell!

but i did mention before that will seems to be growing into his identity and accepting it in S4 more than what the audience noticed at first glance--he's painting for mike ( putting his heart and soul into a gift for his crush that symbolizes his love for him, what they do together and their party ) & is standing in front of a classroom and calling Alan Turing his hero.

he's being brave. his love for mike is motivating him.

"You make her ( me ) feel like she's ( I'm ) not a mistake at all and better for being different. And that gives her (me ) the courage to fight on."

but he succumbed to lying to mike at the end, bc he doesn't think there's a chance at love between then anymore. and sure, i see will being able to eventually be okay with just friendship, but the thing is that the painting lie is this ticking time bomb hanging over his head that'll explode at any given moment and the consequence, he probably believes, is being banished. so this isn't a normal 'my crush likes someone else' situation--there's something extremely anxiety-inducing in between.

so maybe we can say Chance represents a literal chance for Will to find himself outside of his bond with Mike. It IS risky and dangerous for sure, but maybe it starts as a way for him to try to heal, & depending on how the narrative goes, it might be very nice at first, but he eventually realizes it is more of a coping mechanism because he still has feelings for Mike. but he still learned something valuable about himself in the process. ( I'm still thinking out this part tbh )

but the main point is that Bychance subverts all of these 'One True Love/Soulmate/Love at First Sight' tropes in a way that feels thematically cohesive and natural to me. those ideas belong, and die with, mileven ( which is why us bylers disliked it so much to begin with ) imagine Bychance and Mileven paralleling each other in a way where it is more obvious with Bychance, but once you rewatch the show and see Mikes behavior in S1 you're like "oh ..."

'show don't tell' at its finest.

Byler are soulmates and each other's one and only bc they're a team--byler is about being with the Right Person For You. And being able to understand yourself enough to recognize when someone's good for you and you're good for them is important, it is part of growing and healing.

Thankyou @ven0moir . After reading your take, i feel like, my understanding of Will's character feels a bit linear and slightly naive, like "he's supposed to act this way," blah blah. Your perspective offers a more mature and nuanced view of Will. After all, he is "Will the Wise" who might, as you suggested, lean on some coping mechanisms to heal (or, less ideally but still possible, sink deeper into depression)

The TEAM dynamic you mentioned is spot on, too, because teams often deal with misunderstandings, communication gaps, disputes, and differences, but ultimately, their end goal is the same.

I overlooked the fact that so far, Mike has only shown joy after receiving Will’s painting, which means Will hasn’t really received an ideal response to his heartfelt confession, which could leave him feeling frustrated deep down. When Will is at his most vulnerable, Vecna and other distractions might take the 'chance' to strike.

I 100% agree with your perspective, bychance fits into the show because Duffers normally subvert cliche tropes, potentially using it to challenge one of the oldest narratives of "one true love." Your quote perfectly captures why I now believe the idea of bychance isn't just a 'Love triangle plot' : "Bychance subverts all of these 'One True Love/Soulmate/Love at First Sight' tropes in a way that feels thematically cohesive and natural to me. those ideas belong, and die with, mileven (which is why us bylers disliked it so much to begin with)

omg thank you for these points also, honestly hadn't thought about the idea of teams. and you're valid, we'll see what happens! i just do try my best to consider that this is also a horror show where the metaphor and reality ( both ours and the show's ) blend in a way that i'm still learning to understand and organize--so i'm doing my best to keep my mind open to different ideas and interpretations on this bc i just genuinely think certain things aren't simple coincidence.

right now, i feel that if they are introducing bychance after all, it would be to subvert those tropes, offer context on mike's behavior via show don't tell ( as the show has done before, for example how they said in s2 that will would experince PTSD symptoms but the one we saw actually acting out those symptoms was mike ), and to give will hope that, even if mike isn't his 'one true love', there are still others out there like him.

imo that'll elevate byler to a more mature *and* life-long partnership. and hey, if i'm wrong as i try to follow the breadcrumbs the duffers have left, i'll probably change course at some point to something that feels better. but for now im having fun exploring this theory!

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will80sbyers

Will has to still accept himself on screen and they didn't dig into that enough for him to magically be doing gay stuff explicitly with anyone, Mike is the only one he would trust enough to do something like kissing him

i get where you're coming from entirely! tbf tho ( and this is all subject to change as i explore the theory further ) as of right now, bychance is being theorized and explored as will's coping mechanism--entering s5, he'll be operating on the belief that once the painting lie inevitably comes out, he will lose not only mike, but his entire party as well. He expects banishment to be the consequence since 'friend's don't lie' is the most important rule of the party. and what do we know about will?

he's a survivor.

will's coping mechanism so far has been his art, but chances are that, bc his art is now 'tainted' with heartbreak, he'll be experiencing art block like how mike couldn't really bring himself to deliver the same energy in his campaigns after experiencing trauma at the end of S1.

i don't think this means he'll be out to try to find a different party/replacement consciously since Chance will be the one to approach him first. And this would have to be done in a way that would make Will accept the risk of getting to know him. ( as for the writer's intention, i'm thinking its 'training' for will to integrate his shadow before the finale, and also getting some experience/self-knowledge before getting with mike )

and honestly thank god for the writers adding in the scene with Jonathan and Will post-painting reveal bc it opens the door for Will to come to him about this at some point.

tysm for bringing up this very important and valid point! definitely giving me a lot to consider with the way will's internalized homophobia has been depicted so far, since one of the things i've been a bit stuck on is the flow of Chance and Will "getting together."

i'm assuming it would take some sort of S5-plot related event to prompt him to actually go for it, so for now i'm just kinda trusting my gut.

Will, despite being the most sought-after and good looking in the group, has intentionally avoided any romantic flings, flirtations, or casual hookups. While it’s true that Will is the sensitive one who has faced a rough childhood and possibly dealing with feelings of depression, but it's also true that he has made his feelings for Mike clear by painting a heart on Mike's shield. It’s a signal that he's got desires, is capable of love, and longs to be loved.

I’m not completely against Will exploring only and exclusively Mike, Sure, if Mike is Will's first kiss, it would symbolize ONE TRUE LOVE, Mike is THE ONE, with whom Will is destined to be with forevermore. But if he were to kiss someone else (be it a guy or a girl) to realize he wholeheartedly belongs with Mike, it wouldn’t be a terrible thing. Mike has kissed El multiple times, yet Will "gorgeous" Byers has swiped left every time because his boy is busy snogging a girl. He’s been waiting for Mike to end his 'Hetero RPG campaign' (Sorry, Mike, but can’t you see that Will has been waiting for four seasons?! Mister "I’m busy kissing your sister," wake up, buddy! It’s time to set the record straight! Enough now!).

Maybe Robin, who was mismatching Steve and Nancy in s4, tells Will to go out and explore the gay world and give Mr. Chance a try, as they'll be 18+ in S5 with Will stepping into adulthood and would likely want to explore his life a little. But the worst-case setup would be portraying a "Desperate Will", a Will who suddenly jumps at the opportunity to go out with Chance! the same Will who has held off on kissing anyone because he’s fixated solely on Mike!? Not the best arc imo. I don’t want Will to come off like Josie (Drew Barrymore, from Never Been Kissed, desperately longing for a kiss)

Will's character is actually the opposite. He’s popular with the ladies and probably has admirers among the closeted guys at Hawkins High. Also, it would undermine the reason the Duffers chose to portray Will as a chick magnet who, despite having every opportunity, isn’t desperate for social acceptance. He’s likely exhausted by the attention but never desperate. Unless they planned to show a contrast: Mike choosing El because he conformed to heteronormative social norms, while Will didn’t back down despite countless offers from girls. Or, on a lighter note, Mike could be practicing kissing with El to get ready to woo Will later with his newfound smoothness.

The best scenario would be Will turning down offers from girls and Chance right in front of Mike, making it clear,  "What now Mike? what the hell are you waiting for?! Do you need another season to ask me out and hold my hand?!" Or is it.....

HELP omg ty for this input!! let me expand and revise my argument a bit taking this into account bc yeah i don't think we'll see will being desperate/chasing chance either! rather, i think will is going to be in a position where he needs to decide whether or not he takes the chance ( lmao? ) to be with someone else or not. ( & i also think the reason why he's turned down girls is bc he just Doesn't Like Them. Remember what Jonathan said to him in S1? He shouldn't like things bc people tell him he's supposed to. )

whether he goes to someone else for advice, or makes the decision on his own bc of his trust issues, i'm not sure yet, only time will tell!

but i did mention before that will seems to be growing into his identity and accepting it in S4 more than what the audience noticed at first glance--he's painting for mike ( putting his heart and soul into a gift for his crush that symbolizes his love for him, what they do together and their party ) & is standing in front of a classroom and calling Alan Turing his hero.

he's being brave. his love for mike is motivating him.

"You make her ( me ) feel like she's ( I'm ) not a mistake at all and better for being different. And that gives her (me ) the courage to fight on."

but he succumbed to lying to mike at the end, bc he doesn't think there's a chance at love between then anymore. and sure, i see will being able to eventually be okay with just friendship, but the thing is that the painting lie is this ticking time bomb hanging over his head that'll explode at any given moment and the consequence, he probably believes, is being banished. so this isn't a normal 'my crush likes someone else' situation--there's something extremely anxiety-inducing in between.

so maybe we can say Chance represents a literal chance for Will to find himself outside of his bond with Mike. It IS risky and dangerous for sure, but maybe it starts as a way for him to try to heal, & depending on how the narrative goes, it might be very nice at first, but he eventually realizes it is more of a coping mechanism because he still has feelings for Mike. but he still learned something valuable about himself in the process. ( I'm still thinking out this part tbh )

but the main point is that Bychance subverts all of these 'One True Love/Soulmate/Love at First Sight' tropes in a way that feels thematically cohesive and natural to me. those ideas belong, and die with, mileven ( which is why us bylers disliked it so much to begin with ) imagine Bychance and Mileven paralleling each other in a way where it is more obvious with Bychance, but once you rewatch the show and see Mikes behavior in S1 you're like "oh ..."

'show don't tell' at its finest.

Byler are soulmates and each other's one and only bc they're a team--byler is about being with the Right Person For You. And being able to understand yourself enough to recognize when someone's good for you and you're good for them is important, it is part of growing and healing.

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will80sbyers

Will has to still accept himself on screen and they didn't dig into that enough for him to magically be doing gay stuff explicitly with anyone, Mike is the only one he would trust enough to do something like kissing him

i get where you're coming from entirely! tbf tho ( and this is all subject to change as i explore the theory further ) as of right now, bychance is being theorized and explored as will's coping mechanism--entering s5, he'll be operating on the belief that once the painting lie inevitably comes out, he will lose not only mike, but his entire party as well. He expects banishment to be the consequence since 'friend's don't lie' is the most important rule of the party. and what do we know about will?

he's a survivor.

will's coping mechanism so far has been his art, but chances are that, bc his art is now 'tainted' with heartbreak, he'll be experiencing art block like how mike couldn't really bring himself to deliver the same energy in his campaigns after experiencing trauma at the end of S1.

i don't think this means he'll be out to try to find a different party/replacement consciously since Chance will be the one to approach him first. And this would have to be done in a way that would make Will accept the risk of getting to know him. ( as for the writer's intention, i'm thinking its 'training' for will to integrate his shadow before the finale, and also getting some experience/self-knowledge before getting with mike )

and honestly thank god for the writers adding in the scene with Jonathan and Will post-painting reveal bc it opens the door for Will to come to him about this at some point.

tysm for bringing up this very important and valid point! definitely giving me a lot to consider with the way will's internalized homophobia has been depicted so far, since one of the things i've been a bit stuck on is the flow of Chance and Will "getting together."

i'm assuming it would take some sort of S5-plot related event to prompt him to actually go for it, so for now i'm just kinda trusting my gut.

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will80sbyers

Mmmh I guess we'll see what happens but honestly I don't think that's how it works for him as a character, I don't see how that could be a realistic coping mechanism because he's too ashamed to let anyone even explicitly know let alone to let a guy he doesn't trust physically touch him in that sense, even if he's heartbroken :/

I think Will is still too ashamed of being gay for now and the writers have not explored his internalized homophobia explicitly enough so they're gonna do that with Vecna most likely! In the scene with Jonathan it's clear he's terrified even for him to find out, it's something too deep within him for it to be realistic that he would be dating a random stranger imo

Also again I really don't think he would date a bully no matter what happened with Mike, it's just too out of character even if Henry has part infiltrated his mind unless he has full control I can't see that happening at all - and we do know a few things about the BTS where I'm almost sure Chance will not really have scenes with them outside of the bullying going on so I can't really see them develop this storyline... oh and Noah doesn't even follow the actor on Instagram which would be very weird if they had intimate scenes together and he usually does follow even random ppl so uh idk I'm thinking they don't even have many lines together 😭

I guess he could have a random boyfriend before if he wasn't one of the bullies and they somehow made him initiate but I don't really think that's the storyline they're gonna focus on, it would distract too much from byler tbh and be a big risk that people would think Will doesn't love him as much as they have shown us all in season 4 and could "get over him" in their minds, they have to show it's one of those loves that's it's so unconditional that reciprocating it is extremely easy also because of the power of that love - so the majority of the GA gets on board

i wouldn't put much stake on what the actors do or say outside of the show tbh, since it is their job to keep the most important details of the story an absolute secret.

but yeah, my sweet son :( he really is--i circle back to the whole thing with the painting. he was integrating parts of himself and becoming proud in a way--he looked more confident in his identity ( and whole!!! ) this season for sure. his love for mike was helping him heal & grow.

for example, him making a presentation on alan turing and everything. i don't think its hit us yet how shattering the van scene truly was--as someone who draws, art is my therapy. without it, i'd go insane. so i can only imagine having put all of my love and feelings into a painting for my crush that wasn't only a symbolic representation of my feelings for him, but for all the things we love doing together + our friends. and then that got thrown out the window.

at the same time this is the character that doesn't want to be babied. and we know this season isn't just sexuality and mike for him, it's him coming into his own as a young man, which means agency ( taking chances and risks ) and not just being an observer in his own life. any relationship he gets into would be a vehicle for growth, so when mike and will get together in the end it feels deserved, well thought out and real.

we'll see what ends up happening!

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will80sbyers

Will has to still accept himself on screen and they didn't dig into that enough for him to magically be doing gay stuff explicitly with anyone, Mike is the only one he would trust enough to do something like kissing him

i get where you're coming from entirely! tbf tho ( and this is all subject to change as i explore the theory further ) as of right now, bychance is being theorized and explored as will's coping mechanism--entering s5, he'll be operating on the belief that once the painting lie inevitably comes out, he will lose not only mike, but his entire party as well. He expects banishment to be the consequence since 'friend's don't lie' is the most important rule of the party. and what do we know about will?

he's a survivor.

will's coping mechanism so far has been his art, but chances are that, bc his art is now 'tainted' with heartbreak, he'll be experiencing art block like how mike couldn't really bring himself to deliver the same energy in his campaigns after experiencing trauma at the end of S1.

i don't think this means he'll be out to try to find a different party/replacement consciously since Chance will be the one to approach him first. And this would have to be done in a way that would make Will accept the risk of getting to know him. ( as for the writer's intention, i'm thinking its 'training' for will to integrate his shadow before the finale, and also getting some experience/self-knowledge before getting with mike )

and honestly thank god for the writers adding in the scene with Jonathan and Will post-painting reveal bc it opens the door for Will to come to him about this at some point.

tysm for bringing up this very important and valid point! definitely giving me a lot to consider with the way will's internalized homophobia has been depicted so far, since one of the things i've been a bit stuck on is the flow of Chance and Will "getting together."

i'm assuming it would take some sort of S5-plot related event to prompt him to actually go for it, so for now i'm just kinda trusting my gut.

ill never forgive bylertwt for how they treated lesbianmindflayer back in 2022. she was ahead of her time and deserved so much better than how those losers treated her

it angers me even more how bylers treated her bc id expect better from bylers since as a collective we're supposed to be the "film makers" and "creatives" --but i am glad it seems her analyses are being remembered now and treated with the respect they deserve.

i wish i remembered the specific names but it was honestly like a mass dogpile so yeah but

lesbianmindflayer if you're out there you are loved

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