Property talk:P1721

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Hanyu Pinyin transliteration
hanyu pinyin transliteration of a Mandarin Chinese text (usually to be used as a qualifier)

Description	name bestowed upon a person at adulthood
Represents	pinyin (Q42222)
Data type	String
Domain	Q5 (note: this should be moved to the property statements)
Allowed values	[A-UW-Za-uw-zÜüĀĒĪŌŪǕāēīōūǖÁÉÍÓÚǗáéíóúǘǍĚǏǑǓǙǎěǐǒǔǚÀÈÌÒÙǛàèìòùǜ', -:]+(.*[ÜüĀĒĪŌŪǕāēīōūǖÁÉÍÓÚǗáéíóúǘǍĚǏǑǓǙǎěǐǒǔǚÀÈÌÒÙǛàèìòùǜ].*|[^aeiou]?h?[aeiou]{0,3}(n|ng|r)?)
Example	Fortune Cookie of Love (Q15912263) → Ài de xìngyùn qūqí liquid water (Q29053744) → yètài shuǐ
See also	transliteration or transcription (P2440), ISO 15919 transliteration (P5825), literal translation (P2441)
Lists	Most recently created items Items with novalue claims Items with unknown value claims Usage history (total) Usage history (main statement) Chart by item creation date Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721
Proposal discussion	Proposal discussion
Current uses	Total 16,827 Main statement 1,913 11.4% of uses Qualifier 14,906 88.6% of uses Reference 8 <0.1% of uses
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[create Create a translatable help page (preferably in English) for this property to be included here]

Scope is as qualifier (Q54828449): the property must be used by specified way only (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721#Scope, SPARQL

Format “[A-UW-Za-uw-zÜüĀĒĪŌŪǕāēīōūǖÁÉÍÓÚǗáéíóúǘǍĚǏǑǓǙǎěǐǒǔǚÀÈÌÒÙǛàèìòùǜ', -:]+”: value must be formatted using this pattern (PCRE syntax). (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721#Format, SPARQL

Allowed entity types are Wikibase item (Q29934200), Wikibase form (Q54285143), Wikibase MediaInfo (Q59712033), Wikibase sense (Q54285715): the property may only be used on a certain entity type (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721#Entity types

Scope is as main value (Q54828448): the property must be used by specified way only (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721#Scope, SPARQL

Lexeme language: Standard Mandarin (Q727694), Lan–Yin Mandarin (Q662754): this property should only be applied to lexemes with these languages (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721#language

Format “(.*[ÜüĀĒĪŌŪǕāēīōūǖÁÉÍÓÚǗáéíóúǘǍĚǏǑǓǙǎěǐǒǔǚÀÈÌÒÙǛàèìòùǜ].*|[^aeiou]?h?[aeiou]{0,3}(n|ng|r)?)”: value must be formatted using this pattern (PCRE syntax). (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1721#Format, SPARQL

This property is being used by: ru:Шаблон:Маньхуа Please notify projects that use this property before big changes (renaming, deletion, merge with another property, etc.)

Use for Lexemes?

@Giftzwerg 88, Zolo, Innocent bystander, Pasleim, Nikki: We now have Lexemes. Do we intend to use this property on Lexemes? Or should we create a new property? Deryck Chan (talk) 16:23, 20 December 2018 (UTC)

Oh, I missed this ping. I intend to use it on lexemes and I can't imagine a new property would be approved because there's no semantic difference between the pinyin transliteration of a string or monolingual text statement and the pinyin transliteration of a form. - Nikki (talk) 09:01, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

Property scope

I added as main value (Q54828448) to the property scope in Special:Diff/1331509337 because it's needed to avoid constraint errors on lexeme forms. This unfortunately makes the constraint fairly useless but we don't have a way to restrict constraints to particular entity types. If you think we should (or shouldn't), perhaps you'd like to comment on the ticket I created recently for it - phab:T269724.

- Nikki (talk) 09:11, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

new Wade-Giles romanization property?

Although Library of Congress (Q131454) has replace Wade-Giles (Q208442) with pinyin (Q42222) as the default romanization system since about 1990, but many historical documents still use Wade-Giles (Q208442) to romanize Chinese proper noun (Q147276) and many people outside mainland China (Q19188) may use Wade-Giles (Q208442).

For example, Hu Shih (Q47667)'s English tag is Hu Shih, Zhang Zhizhong (Q197347)'s alias name Chang Chih-chung.

I think Wikidata should have a Wade-Giles (Q208442) property like Hanyu Pinyin transliteration (P1721).

@Nikki, Deryck Chan, Zolo: Kethyga (talk) 06:09, 13 April 2022 (UTC)

While Hanzi to pinyin transliteration is sometimes tricky to automate, pinyin can be converted to Wade-Giles using simple deterministic rules. I think using only one transliteration system in Wikidata is simpler. Others can be automatically generated by the client when needed. Zolo (talk) 22:09, 14 April 2022 (UTC)

The mapping between Wade-Giles and Hanyu Pinyin technically isn't one-to-one, as they represent different points in time: WG for late 19th century Beijing; Pinyin for today's Beijing. The convoluted mapping explained in e.g. w:Wade–Giles#Vowel_o is best explained as a historical sound shift. I'm ambivalent about a WG property though, as you've rightly pointed out that it mainly serves a historical purpose, and a dedicated property might encourage spurious creation of transliterations of Mandarin words that did not exist until the 21st century. Deryck Chan (talk) 23:27, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

I'm in favour of dedicated transliteration properties. People are already adding Wade-Giles transliterations using transliteration or transcription (P2440), but that property is problematic because it requires a qualifier but is often used as a qualifier itself. - Nikki (talk) 08:51, 27 April 2022 (UTC)

I have seen several Anglosphere (Q541576) countries document historical material with Wade-Giles (Q208442), Library of Congress (Q131454), National Library of Australia (Q623578). Take Song Jian (Q9184985)'s Library of Congress authority ID (P244) webpage [1] as an example, without strenuous search, one won't easily know Chung-kuo kʻo hsüeh chia tzʻu tien is 中国科学家辞典/zhōngguó kēxuéjiā cídiǎn, a series of books published in 1982. Basically, most Chinese people can't read the book title. A property is deserved to record the historical material. Kethyga (talk) 10:23, 27 April 2022 (UTC)